We can just add void years to Kirk's contract

diehardtwinsfan
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We can just add void years to Kirk's contract Dec 11, 2021 15:43:06 GMT -6

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Post by diehardtwinsfan on Dec 11, 2021 15:43:06 GMT -6

Dec 9, 2021 11:52:47 GMT -6 whoskmoon said:

Dec 9, 2021 11:42:39 GMT -6 NoresemanSam said:

My opinion. At the end of the season, we need to choose one of the following two options: a) commit to Kirk being our QB beyond 2022 or b) commit to moving on from Kirk. Adding voidable years doesn't fit with either of these. If we choose "a," then we extend him and convert some of his $35M base salary to signing bonus to lower 2022 cap hit. If we choose "b," then we place him on the trade market realizing that the acquiring team will likely demand that we lower his 2022 $35M guaranteed salary by converting $10M - $15M to signing bonus (which we would immediately eat when he is traded.) The acquiring team would then have a top ten QB on a one year rental at $20M to $25M. That would lower his 2022 cap hit from $45M to $20M - $25M. Voidable years are a dumb idea in most/all scenarios. It's the sign of a team in awful cap hell because they've likely overpaid aging veterans and shiny free agents. Granted, we're likely guilty of both to a moderate degree, but we aren't close to a Lombardi so the future is NOT now.

Adding voidable years does not stop you from trading Kirk. All it does is lower his cap hit this year, which would do the same thing you are arguing for with converting his salary to signing bonus. Make him more tradeable because his base salary is lower.

You can also trade him and agree to eat a certain percentage of the contract.. No need to do void years in that scenario.

diehardtwinsfan
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We can just add void years to Kirk's contract Dec 11, 2021 15:49:53 GMT -6 Reignman likes this

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Post by diehardtwinsfan on Dec 11, 2021 15:49:53 GMT -6

Dec 9, 2021 19:00:46 GMT -6 comet52 said:

Dec 9, 2021 9:06:19 GMT -6 whoskmoon said:

Let's break down what a realistic extension to save cap would look like for Cousins:

Cousins gets 2 years, 90 million fully guaranteed. It is what he will demand and will not sign anything less (might even be more). We then convert 15 million to signing bonus spreading it out over the next 2 years.

Doesn't that demand rest on him having a viable market for his services at that price? When he signed with the Vikings the first time the Jets were after him and even offered more but he took the Vikes offer. When we extended him there wasn't necessarily some other team out there that would pay that price, it was mainly Rick making a Rick move (I'll let others debate the wisdom of it, personally I was not in favor).

So who is out there in 2023, ready to hand Kirk 45 mil/year other than maybe daffy Rick Spielman which is of course a distinct (and terrifying) possibility? As good as his stats are, he's been at this long enough that unless some g.m. is really a fool or a tool, they are going to balk at paying a guy who is clearly not in the top 6-7 qb's that kind of cash, unless the salary range for next-tier qb's goes way up all of a sudden. Which it might, hard to say.

Someone will pay him... perhaps not that much, but if he hits the market in 2023 posting similar numbers in 2022 as he did through his career here, he'll get a contract and a starting job somewhere.

I don't think he'll necessarily get that kind of cash. To some extent, he's built some value and shed some narratives this year and if given a good line he would be a great option for a QB needy team at a lower price... so yeah, someone will pay for him. I do think the league as a whole has wised up at this point and probably won't shell out that kind of cash. Nor should they.

I'd be fine with him back here at a much lower price allowing the team to get some top FAs around him, but realistically speaking, I suspect we're much better off trading him this offseason. He certainly won't get the Stafford trade, but I suspect some team a QB short will likely pony up a 1st and change. That's what I'd do... Let Mond have 2022 and if he sucks... well, you're drafting high for a much better QB class while Mond becomes the bridge QB.

whoskmoon
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We can just add void years to Kirk's contract Dec 11, 2021 17:18:57 GMT -6 via mobile

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Post by whoskmoon on Dec 11, 2021 17:18:57 GMT -6

Dec 11, 2021 15:43:06 GMT -6 diehardtwinsfan said:

Dec 9, 2021 11:52:47 GMT -6 whoskmoon said:

Adding voidable years does not stop you from trading Kirk. All it does is lower his cap hit this year, which would do the same thing you are arguing for with converting his salary to signing bonus. Make him more tradeable because his base salary is lower.

You can also trade him and agree to eat a certain percentage of the contract.. No need to do void years in that scenario.

I agree.

NoresemanSam
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We can just add void years to Kirk's contract Dec 11, 2021 18:09:17 GMT -6

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Post by NoresemanSam on Dec 11, 2021 18:09:17 GMT -6

Dec 11, 2021 15:49:53 GMT -6 diehardtwinsfan said:

I'd be fine with him back here at a much lower price allowing the team to get some top FAs around him,

Top FAs cost a fortune. Even if Kirk took a huge pay cut (he won't) you might be able to squeeze in one "top FA."

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We can just add void years to Kirk's contract Dec 11, 2021 18:26:45 GMT -6 Reignman likes this

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Post by comet52 on Dec 11, 2021 18:26:45 GMT -6

Dec 11, 2021 15:49:53 GMT -6 diehardtwinsfan said:

Dec 9, 2021 19:00:46 GMT -6 comet52 said:

Doesn't that demand rest on him having a viable market for his services at that price? When he signed with the Vikings the first time the Jets were after him and even offered more but he took the Vikes offer. When we extended him there wasn't necessarily some other team out there that would pay that price, it was mainly Rick making a Rick move (I'll let others debate the wisdom of it, personally I was not in favor).

So who is out there in 2023, ready to hand Kirk 45 mil/year other than maybe daffy Rick Spielman which is of course a distinct (and terrifying) possibility? As good as his stats are, he's been at this long enough that unless some g.m. is really a fool or a tool, they are going to balk at paying a guy who is clearly not in the top 6-7 qb's that kind of cash, unless the salary range for next-tier qb's goes way up all of a sudden. Which it might, hard to say.

Someone will pay him... perhaps not that much, but if he hits the market in 2023 posting similar numbers in 2022 as he did through his career here, he'll get a contract and a starting job somewhere.

I don't think he'll necessarily get that kind of cash. To some extent, he's built some value and shed some narratives this year and if given a good line he would be a great option for a QB needy team at a lower price... so yeah, someone will pay for him. I do think the league as a whole has wised up at this point and probably won't shell out that kind of cash. Nor should they.

I'd be fine with him back here at a much lower price allowing the team to get some top FAs around him, but realistically speaking, I suspect we're much better off trading him this offseason. He certainly won't get the Stafford trade, but I suspect some team a QB short will likely pony up a 1st and change. That's what I'd do... Let Mond have 2022 and if he sucks... well, you're drafting high for a much better QB class while Mond becomes the bridge QB.

That's how I would do it as well. But this organization doesn't really make smart moves that involve the slightest level of short term pain for long term gain. It's all buy now pay later nonsense. Maybe if they jettison Rick and Mike and find competent leadership... longshot at best imho. We could be back here in a year with both those guys still running things and Kirk extended into another bad contract and more of the same mediocre insanity. I wouldn't put it past Wilf.

I'm here for entertainment purposes only

snotbubbles
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We can just add void years to Kirk's contract Dec 11, 2021 20:19:33 GMT -6 comet52 likes this

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Post by snotbubbles on Dec 11, 2021 20:19:33 GMT -6

Dec 11, 2021 18:26:45 GMT -6 comet52 said:

Dec 11, 2021 15:49:53 GMT -6 diehardtwinsfan said:

Someone will pay him... perhaps not that much, but if he hits the market in 2023 posting similar numbers in 2022 as he did through his career here, he'll get a contract and a starting job somewhere.

I don't think he'll necessarily get that kind of cash. To some extent, he's built some value and shed some narratives this year and if given a good line he would be a great option for a QB needy team at a lower price... so yeah, someone will pay for him. I do think the league as a whole has wised up at this point and probably won't shell out that kind of cash. Nor should they.

I'd be fine with him back here at a much lower price allowing the team to get some top FAs around him, but realistically speaking, I suspect we're much better off trading him this offseason. He certainly won't get the Stafford trade, but I suspect some team a QB short will likely pony up a 1st and change. That's what I'd do... Let Mond have 2022 and if he sucks... well, you're drafting high for a much better QB class while Mond becomes the bridge QB.

That's how I would do it as well. But this organization doesn't really make smart moves that involve the slightest level of short term pain for long term gain. It's all buy now pay later nonsense. Maybe if they jettison Rick and Mike and find competent leadership... longshot at best imho. We could be back here in a year with both those guys still running things and Kirk extended into another bad contract and more of the same mediocre insanity. I wouldn't put it past Wilf.

Wow...I need a drink.

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We can just add void years to Kirk's contract Dec 12, 2021 2:37:42 GMT -6

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Post by Reignman on Dec 12, 2021 2:37:42 GMT -6

Dec 10, 2021 1:45:14 GMT -6 @aussie61 said:

100% agree with this^^^
People think because New Orleans did it with Brees then void years must be the way to go, too easy right?

Thanks Rob! *thumb_up*

But what about doing it in the context of making a Super Bowl run, or because you think your Super Bowl window is wide open? Not that I think ours is or that we're even close, especially with a guy like Cousins, but the Saints were close, and Larry and Moe might think we're close too.

Aug 8, 2024 18:42:12 GMT -6 whoskmoon said:

if sitting and watching something versus actually doing it made a person great at it, Reignman would be the next Ron Jeremy.

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We can just add void years to Kirk's contract Dec 12, 2021 6:53:55 GMT -6 Reignman and comet52 like this

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Post by Deleted on Dec 12, 2021 6:53:55 GMT -6

Dec 12, 2021 2:37:42 GMT -6 Reignman said:

Dec 10, 2021 1:45:14 GMT -6 @aussie61 said:

100% agree with this^^^
People think because New Orleans did it with Brees then void years must be the way to go, too easy right?

Thanks Rob! *thumb_up*

But what about doing it in the context of making a Super Bowl run, or because you think your Super Bowl window is wide open? Not that I think ours is or that we're even close, especially with a guy like Cousins, but the Saints were close, and Larry and Moe might think we're close too.

To add void years the Vikings would need Cousins to agree to it. Because he is going in to the final year of his contract, to add more years to it (even void years) constitutes a new contract which Cousins would need to sign.

And if Larry and Moe think the Vikings are capable of a Super Bowl run with this defense, then you have two candidates to be loaded on the first bus to the cuckoo farm.

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We can just add void years to Kirk's contract Dec 12, 2021 13:36:58 GMT -6

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Post by Danchat on Dec 12, 2021 13:36:58 GMT -6

Dec 12, 2021 6:53:55 GMT -6 @aussie61 said:

Dec 12, 2021 2:37:42 GMT -6 Reignman said:

Thanks Rob! *thumb_up*

But what about doing it in the context of making a Super Bowl run, or because you think your Super Bowl window is wide open? Not that I think ours is or that we're even close, especially with a guy like Cousins, but the Saints were close, and Larry and Moe might think we're close too.

To add void years the Vikings would need Cousins to agree to it. Because he is going in to the final year of his contract, to add more years to it (even void years) constitutes a new contract which Cousins would need to sign.

And if Larry and Moe think the Vikings are capable of a Super Bowl run with this defense, then you have two candidates to be loaded on the first bus to the cuckoo farm.

I'm not sure if that's true, and if it is, there is no reason for Kirk to say no since it won't change the amount of money he will be making. I don't think Kirk cares about what accounting tricks the Vikings will make as long as he gets his dough.

whoskmoon
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We can just add void years to Kirk's contract Dec 12, 2021 14:57:43 GMT -6 via mobile

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Post by whoskmoon on Dec 12, 2021 14:57:43 GMT -6

Dec 12, 2021 2:37:42 GMT -6 Reignman said:

Dec 10, 2021 1:45:14 GMT -6 @aussie61 said:

100% agree with this^^^
People think because New Orleans did it with Brees then void years must be the way to go, too easy right?

Thanks Rob! *thumb_up*

But what about doing it in the context of making a Super Bowl run, or because you think your Super Bowl window is wide open? Not that I think ours is or that we're even close, especially with a guy like Cousins, but the Saints were close, and Larry and Moe might think we're close too.

This isn't about winning a SB. It is about not extending a QB to save cap in 2022.

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We can just add void years to Kirk's contract Dec 12, 2021 15:23:35 GMT -6 comet52 likes this

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Post by Reignman on Dec 12, 2021 15:23:35 GMT -6

Dec 12, 2021 14:57:43 GMT -6 whoskmoon said:

Dec 12, 2021 2:37:42 GMT -6 Reignman said:

Thanks Rob! *thumb_up*

But what about doing it in the context of making a Super Bowl run, or because you think your Super Bowl window is wide open? Not that I think ours is or that we're even close, especially with a guy like Cousins, but the Saints were close, and Larry and Moe might think we're close too.

This isn't about winning a SB. It is about not extending a QB to save cap in 2022.

Sorry, you lost me at "This isn't about winning a SB" *blink*

Aug 8, 2024 18:42:12 GMT -6 whoskmoon said:

if sitting and watching something versus actually doing it made a person great at it, Reignman would be the next Ron Jeremy.

whoskmoon
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We can just add void years to Kirk's contract Dec 12, 2021 16:40:32 GMT -6 via mobile Reignman likes this

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Post by whoskmoon on Dec 12, 2021 16:40:32 GMT -6

Dec 12, 2021 15:23:35 GMT -6 Reignman said:

Dec 12, 2021 14:57:43 GMT -6 whoskmoon said:

This isn't about winning a SB. It is about not extending a QB to save cap in 2022.

Sorry, you lost me at "This isn't about winning a SB" *blink*

Neither adding void years or extending Cousins will win a SB, but one of those options will lower the chances of winning one. Help?

Deleted Ghosted Member Posts: 0 Likes:	We can just add void years to Kirk's contract Dec 12, 2021 19:00:57 GMT -6 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by Deleted on Dec 12, 2021 19:00:57 GMT -6 Dec 12, 2021 13:36:58 GMT -6 Danchat said: I'm not sure if that's true, Then you'd be wrong.

legendsofthenorth
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We can just add void years to Kirk's contract Dec 12, 2021 19:16:17 GMT -6 via mobile

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Post by legendsofthenorth on Dec 12, 2021 19:16:17 GMT -6

Only way you don't extend Kirk is if you have identified a QB that will be your future.

If that's Mond. Great
If it's a QB in this class you can get. Great
Don't bank on 2023 Draft because you don't know what will happen