DeShaun Watson - Should we trade for him?

Deleted
Ghosted Member

Posts: 0
Likes:

DeShaun Watson - Should we trade for him? Feb 6, 2021 21:15:02 GMT -6

Quote

Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2021 21:15:02 GMT -6

Feb 6, 2021 21:07:02 GMT -6 whoskmoon said:

Feb 6, 2021 20:29:31 GMT -6 @justmy2cents said:

Will you one of these days look at the eye test instead of misleading statistics please. Everybody and they moms know Chiefs a passing team. They defense is not all that. The problem with looking just at stats is you miss the true picture. Chiefs be up over last few years and then run late to run out the clock. There defense is not elite. Matter of fact it's bend but don't break. Since the offense is so good they are in a lot of obvious pass situations. So because of that potent offense they can pin their ears back and just pass rush because they know what is coming. When teams are down they take more risk giving them extra chances for a turnover raising their ranking. News flash nobody fears the defense, Chiefs are who they are from the offense football 101. Eff them stats a teams true identity is what they do when they need it most or down. We be down 14 and still run and walk to the huddle 🤷🏾‍♂️ You a stat stuffer learn football for yourself and what you see. Stats are deceiving sometimes. Teams eating clock start running the ball late, making it look even catch up lol. But what matters is how that team plays in the moment of truth. Chiefs pass to win run to milk clock. You just argue to be arguing.

Stats can absolutely be deceiving, but to use only your "eye test" and not dig to find numbers to see if what you choose to see each Sunday is no way to come to an accurate conclusion. If your eye test tells you one thing, and you can find no numbers to back up that eye test, you are probably fooling yourself into seeing something that isn't really happening.

In other words, come up with a hypothesis based on what you see each Sunday, and prove it to be true with facts.

You said that not me.. You have to use a combination of both. Like I said it is proven most times. THIS IS FACT. Chiefs are a PASSING TEAM PERIOD. Stop arguing just to be arguing you make no sense. I can tell you was trash at football both y'all bye.

whoskmoon
Content Creator

Posts: 8,880
Likes: 7,224

DeShaun Watson - Should we trade for him? Feb 6, 2021 21:15:36 GMT -6

Quote

Post by whoskmoon on Feb 6, 2021 21:15:36 GMT -6

Feb 6, 2021 21:03:15 GMT -6 Raptorman said:

Feb 6, 2021 20:54:43 GMT -6 Reignman said:

As far as Watson goes, I don't know if I'm sold on him enough to sell the farm to get him. Sure he's exciting to watch, and puts up amazing number, but is he a winner? I mean we thought Cousins put up some good numbers too, but he's anything but a winner.

With Mahomes, you knew he was the type of guy who was going to fill the trophy case, even before he did. Can you say that about Watson? He's certainly an upgrade over Kirk, and does have some clutch in him, but I'm worried about the price tag. That's the type of purchase that could get you into buyers remorse pretty quickly lol. Kinda like that last guy we purchased and can't get rid of.

Watson smells like a "compete for the divisional round" every year type of upgrade, but I don't know if he's a Super Bowl caliber upgrade. Not that there are many QB's in the league who meet that standard.

I'm just saying that's my goal. Super Bowl or bust. I'm so done with division crowns, playoff appearances, moral victories, participation trophies, or merely being entertained on Sunday. I want more seasons to actually start feeling like it could be our year, like 2009 and 1998 did. Enough of the hoping the right teams lose week 17 so we can sneak in as the 7th seed type seasons.

I want a team so good that the only way we can lose is if our perfect kicker misses a 39 yard FG, or our pro bowl DB drops an INT in the EZ, or our KAO gets caught with 12 in the huddle, the way the football gods meant for us to lose. In stone cold disbelief that we should have seen coming a mile away but didn't because we momentarily got too caught up in a dream that's apparently not meant for Vikings fans.

Ahhh screw it, YOLO! If we can't have Sloter, what's it going to take to get Watson?

Watson's passing numbers over the past 3 years are almost Identical to Cousin's except in two categories. Rushing, where he has two and half as many attempts and 3 times the yardage. And sacks, 155 to 107. I don't see him as an upgrade, more of lateral move.

Drank, this right here is a prime example of someone using stats to mislead.

Clearly Watson is a top tier QB while Cousins is a very limited one, but because Cousins absolutely destroys terrible defenses, statistically he ends up looking good at the end of seasons despite playing terrible against really good ones.

You have one QB who is far more difficult to stop any given Sunday, and who every GM in the NFL (including Rick) would take over Cousins in a minute, and then you have Cousins who is 0-11 as a Viking against top 10 pass defenses. Which one of those QBs do you want leading your team in the playoffs? The one who sucks against playoff teams (4 wins total against playoff teams since he joined the Vikings, 7 or so in his career (can't remember the number) or the one who actually has the capability to regularly play great against the best teams in the NFL?

Deleted
Ghosted Member

Posts: 0
Likes:

DeShaun Watson - Should we trade for him? Feb 6, 2021 21:22:32 GMT -6

Quote

Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2021 21:22:32 GMT -6

Feb 6, 2021 21:15:36 GMT -6 whoskmoon said:

Feb 6, 2021 21:03:15 GMT -6 Raptorman said:

Watson's passing numbers over the past 3 years are almost Identical to Cousin's except in two categories. Rushing, where he has two and half as many attempts and 3 times the yardage. And sacks, 155 to 107. I don't see him as an upgrade, more of lateral move.

Drank, this right here is a prime example of someone using stats to mislead.

Clearly Watson is a top tier QB while Cousins is a very limited one, but because Cousins absolutely destroys terrible defenses, statistically he ends up looking good at the end of seasons despite playing terrible against really good ones.

You have one QB who is far more difficult to stop any given Sunday, and who every GM in the NFL (including Rick) would take over Cousins in a minute, and then you have Cousins who is 0-11 as a Viking against top 10 pass defenses. Which one of those QBs do you want leading your team in the playoffs? The one who sucks against playoff teams (4 wins total against playoff teams since he joined the Vikings, 7 or so in his career (can't remember the number) or the one who actually has the capability to regularly play great against the best teams in the NFL?

Finally we agree on something lol. Cousins solid but I agree Watson is clearly better. Yes finally we agree on something 😂 That's a start for us bro lol

Deleted
Ghosted Member

Posts: 0
Likes:

DeShaun Watson - Should we trade for him? Feb 6, 2021 21:31:46 GMT -6

Quote

Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2021 21:31:46 GMT -6

Feb 6, 2021 21:15:36 GMT -6 whoskmoon said:

Feb 6, 2021 21:03:15 GMT -6 Raptorman said:

Watson's passing numbers over the past 3 years are almost Identical to Cousin's except in two categories. Rushing, where he has two and half as many attempts and 3 times the yardage. And sacks, 155 to 107. I don't see him as an upgrade, more of lateral move.

Drank, this right here is a prime example of someone using stats to mislead.

Clearly Watson is a top tier QB while Cousins is a very limited one, but because Cousins absolutely destroys terrible defenses, statistically he ends up looking good at the end of seasons despite playing terrible against really good ones.

You have one QB who is far more difficult to stop any given Sunday, and who every GM in the NFL (including Rick) would take over Cousins in a minute, and then you have Cousins who is 0-11 as a Viking against top 10 pass defenses. Which one of those QBs do you want leading your team in the playoffs? The one who sucks against playoff teams (4 wins total against playoff teams since he joined the Vikings, 7 or so in his career (can't remember the number) or the one who actually has the capability to regularly play great against the best teams in the NFL?

Whosk don't take nothing personal you know how passionate I get. We just debating. Yes stats matter to a certain extent but what he put up was misleading. I use stats and eye test in combination. Some stats are more telling than others depending on the situation and argument.

Raptorman
Hall of Fame Inductee

Posts: 18,560

Likes: 8,286
Fan Since: November 6, 1966.

DeShaun Watson - Should we trade for him? Feb 6, 2021 21:37:26 GMT -6

Quote

Post by Raptorman on Feb 6, 2021 21:37:26 GMT -6

Feb 6, 2021 21:15:36 GMT -6 whoskmoon said:

Feb 6, 2021 21:03:15 GMT -6 Raptorman said:

Watson's passing numbers over the past 3 years are almost Identical to Cousin's except in two categories. Rushing, where he has two and half as many attempts and 3 times the yardage. And sacks, 155 to 107. I don't see him as an upgrade, more of lateral move.

Drank, this right here is a prime example of someone using stats to mislead.

Clearly Watson is a top tier QB while Cousins is a very limited one, but because Cousins absolutely destroys terrible defenses, statistically he ends up looking good at the end of seasons despite playing terrible against really good ones.

You have one QB who is far more difficult to stop any given Sunday, and who every GM in the NFL (including Rick) would take over Cousins in a minute, and then you have Cousins who is 0-11 as a Viking against top 10 pass defenses. Which one of those QBs do you want leading your team in the playoffs? The one who sucks against playoff teams (4 wins total against playoff teams since he joined the Vikings, 7 or so in his career (can't remember the number) or the one who actually has the capability to regularly play great against the best teams in the NFL?

Oh please tell us, what are Watson's numbers against top 10 pass defense? You made the comment, so I assume you know.

You can't truly call yourself "peaceful" unless you are capable of great violence. If you are not capable of great violence, you are not peaceful, you are harmless.

Deleted
Ghosted Member

Posts: 0
Likes:

DeShaun Watson - Should we trade for him? Feb 6, 2021 21:42:26 GMT -6

Quote

Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2021 21:42:26 GMT -6

Feb 6, 2021 21:15:36 GMT -6 whoskmoon said:

Feb 6, 2021 21:03:15 GMT -6 Raptorman said:

Watson's passing numbers over the past 3 years are almost Identical to Cousin's except in two categories. Rushing, where he has two and half as many attempts and 3 times the yardage. And sacks, 155 to 107. I don't see him as an upgrade, more of lateral move.

Drank, this right here is a prime example of someone using stats to mislead.

Clearly Watson is a top tier QB while Cousins is a very limited one, but because Cousins absolutely destroys terrible defenses, statistically he ends up looking good at the end of seasons despite playing terrible against really good ones.

You have one QB who is far more difficult to stop any given Sunday, and who every GM in the NFL (including Rick) would take over Cousins in a minute, and then you have Cousins who is 0-11 as a Viking against top 10 pass defenses. Which one of those QBs do you want leading your team in the playoffs? The one who sucks against playoff teams (4 wins total against playoff teams since he joined the Vikings, 7 or so in his career (can't remember the number) or the one who actually has the capability to regularly play great against the best teams in the NFL?

Whosk I will give you a example of what I mean by combination of stats and eye test. Emmitt Smith has the best RB stats all time. So because of that fact I have him in my top 5 backs all time. Regardless of the stats he is not my number one Barry Sanders is. The eye test tells me he is the best I ever seen. I young kid will come around and say Emmitt the best without the whole picture like look at the OLine Smith had. Hope this gives you a clearer picture of how I see things. Several factors tell a whole story beyond just stats.

Deleted
Ghosted Member

Posts: 0
Likes:

DeShaun Watson - Should we trade for him? Feb 6, 2021 21:48:16 GMT -6 vikingpwr likes this

Quote

Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2021 21:48:16 GMT -6

Feb 6, 2021 21:37:26 GMT -6 Raptorman said:

Feb 6, 2021 21:15:36 GMT -6 whoskmoon said:

Drank, this right here is a prime example of someone using stats to mislead.

Clearly Watson is a top tier QB while Cousins is a very limited one, but because Cousins absolutely destroys terrible defenses, statistically he ends up looking good at the end of seasons despite playing terrible against really good ones.

You have one QB who is far more difficult to stop any given Sunday, and who every GM in the NFL (including Rick) would take over Cousins in a minute, and then you have Cousins who is 0-11 as a Viking against top 10 pass defenses. Which one of those QBs do you want leading your team in the playoffs? The one who sucks against playoff teams (4 wins total against playoff teams since he joined the Vikings, 7 or so in his career (can't remember the number) or the one who actually has the capability to regularly play great against the best teams in the NFL?

Oh please tell us, what are Watson's numbers against top 10 pass defense? You made the comment, so I assume you know.

Cousins solid I like him more than most, Watson is clearly better Rap. Watson arm can do anything Cousins can. When you add the ability to improvise scramble and run. All things Cousins can't do physically it makes him better. He can do anything Cousins can, but has things Cousins can't do.

Raptorman
Hall of Fame Inductee

Posts: 18,560

Likes: 8,286
Fan Since: November 6, 1966.

DeShaun Watson - Should we trade for him? Feb 6, 2021 22:09:41 GMT -6

Quote

Post by Raptorman on Feb 6, 2021 22:09:41 GMT -6

Feb 6, 2021 21:48:16 GMT -6 @justmy2cents said:

Feb 6, 2021 21:37:26 GMT -6 Raptorman said:

Oh please tell us, what are Watson's numbers against top 10 pass defense? You made the comment, so I assume you know.

Cousins solid I like him more than most, Watson is clearly better Rap. Watson arm can do anything Cousins can. When you add the ability to improvise scramble and run. All things Cousins can't do physically it makes him better. He can do anything Cousins can, but has things Cousins can't do.

So, if Watson is so much better, Why doesn't he have better overall record the last three years? 25-22 vs 25-21-1.

You can't truly call yourself "peaceful" unless you are capable of great violence. If you are not capable of great violence, you are not peaceful, you are harmless.

Danchat
Content Creator

Posts: 19,048

Likes: 16,642

DeShaun Watson - Should we trade for him? Feb 6, 2021 22:53:42 GMT -6

Quote

Post by Danchat on Feb 6, 2021 22:53:42 GMT -6

Feb 6, 2021 21:37:26 GMT -6 Raptorman said:

Feb 6, 2021 21:15:36 GMT -6 whoskmoon said:

Drank, this right here is a prime example of someone using stats to mislead.

Clearly Watson is a top tier QB while Cousins is a very limited one, but because Cousins absolutely destroys terrible defenses, statistically he ends up looking good at the end of seasons despite playing terrible against really good ones.

You have one QB who is far more difficult to stop any given Sunday, and who every GM in the NFL (including Rick) would take over Cousins in a minute, and then you have Cousins who is 0-11 as a Viking against top 10 pass defenses. Which one of those QBs do you want leading your team in the playoffs? The one who sucks against playoff teams (4 wins total against playoff teams since he joined the Vikings, 7 or so in his career (can't remember the number) or the one who actually has the capability to regularly play great against the best teams in the NFL?

Oh please tell us, what are Watson's numbers against top 10 pass defense? You made the comment, so I assume you know.

Yes, he does, he just posted an update to this article on QB play vs top 10 pass defenses. Check out the post on page 10 from him on February 4th.

Deleted
Ghosted Member

Posts: 0
Likes:

DeShaun Watson - Should we trade for him? Feb 6, 2021 23:11:00 GMT -6 TAFKASP likes this

Quote

Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2021 23:11:00 GMT -6

Feb 6, 2021 22:09:41 GMT -6 Raptorman said:

Feb 6, 2021 21:48:16 GMT -6 @justmy2cents said:

Cousins solid I like him more than most, Watson is clearly better Rap. Watson arm can do anything Cousins can. When you add the ability to improvise scramble and run. All things Cousins can't do physically it makes him better. He can do anything Cousins can, but has things Cousins can't do.

So, if Watson is so much better, Why doesn't he have better overall record the last three years? 25-22 vs 25-21-1.

Lol Jesus bro you think weird on everything lol!It takes a team just like I said for Cousins behalf too,many times. Texans suck and have been ran stupid see Hopkins trade package. Bill O Brien. They stayed in playoffs unlike us with less talent in my opinion. Instead of building on Billy boy kept making dumb move after dumb move and it finally became to much. I will say this, I believe if KC took Watson instead of Mahomes it would be Watson shining. That is how much I think of the talent and how much coach and a plan for the talent brought in, matters in my eyes. Going to the right coach with a plan for you is huge imo if you succeed or not.

Last Edit: Feb 6, 2021 23:12:23 GMT -6 by Deleted

Deleted
Ghosted Member

Posts: 0
Likes:

DeShaun Watson - Should we trade for him? Feb 6, 2021 23:34:06 GMT -6

Quote

Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2021 23:34:06 GMT -6

Rap not trying to be mean but your logic is suspect bro. Check it out Jimmy G and Goff both suck but made a Super Bowl why? Because they both had good offensive minds. Yet those teams want upgrades because they truly suck and they know with real talent they can win it and be more consistent. By your logic those two better than Watson as is Kennum and Foles because they been further which is comical. Around these parts we have a saying " Sun shines on a dogs ass some days". Through the course of time though nature takes its course and you can coach someone up, but it is easier to have real talent. Andy Reid can Damn near take any QB to playoffs he has proven that so you can't just go off records. He needed real talent McNabb and to higher degree Mahomes for super bowl level consistency and finally a ring. Situation,talent around you ,scheme, and coaching plays a huge factor in winning. We actually have coached QBs to maximize talent. I will give the organization credit for that. Let's now take a step up on talent level at QB with our weapons. Those are things you do when you tired of empty trophy 🏆 cases. Cousins solid he not on Watson level though.

vikingpwr
Living Legend

Posts: 21,402

Likes: 4,611

DeShaun Watson - Should we trade for him? Feb 6, 2021 23:57:29 GMT -6

Quote

Post by vikingpwr on Feb 6, 2021 23:57:29 GMT -6

Feb 6, 2021 23:34:06 GMT -6 @justmy2cents said:

Jimmy G and Goff both suck but made a Super Bowl why

Drank, Goff and Jimmy G don't suck. Those two simply are not good enough. Sexy Rexy was the same way when in the Super Bowl. All three of those QBs are ~~good~~ decent QBs but not good enough and have obvious weaknesses.

Last Edit: Feb 6, 2021 23:58:04 GMT -6 by vikingpwr

Deleted
Ghosted Member

Posts: 0
Likes:

DeShaun Watson - Should we trade for him? Feb 7, 2021 0:07:40 GMT -6

Quote

Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2021 0:07:40 GMT -6

Feb 6, 2021 23:57:29 GMT -6 vikingpwr said:

Feb 6, 2021 23:34:06 GMT -6 @justmy2cents said:

Jimmy G and Goff both suck but made a Super Bowl why

Drank, Goff and Jimmy G don't suck. Those two simply are not good enough. Sexy Rexy was the same way when in the Super Bowl. All three of those QBs are ~~good~~ decent QBs but not good enough and have obvious weaknesses.

I think they suck really. Cousins and Stafford I think are average to slightly above average and I would take both over them. I actually don't want to trade Cousins to 49ers. He might win it there if they had him over Jimmy G they might have beat KC. I will give our team credit though on playing to strengths lately Cousins, Keenum, Teddy, Bradford. Now if we could land a QB with uncoachable qualities maybe we can then be real contenders.See my thread Refusing to take steps. If we truly want a chip we have to be willing to roll the dice. Having said that Cousins is solid and I don't blame him for everything, however we made playoffs once in 3 yrs when opportunity knocks you better answer the door or miss out. Especially when your organization never won it all feel me. I would only trade Cousins for a upgrade though Watson fits that description for me.

Last Edit: Feb 7, 2021 0:10:31 GMT -6 by Deleted

vikingpwr
Living Legend

Posts: 21,402

Likes: 4,611

DeShaun Watson - Should we trade for him? Feb 7, 2021 0:15:06 GMT -6

Quote

Post by vikingpwr on Feb 7, 2021 0:15:06 GMT -6

Feb 7, 2021 0:07:40 GMT -6 @justmy2cents said:

I think they suck really. Cousins and Stafford I think are average to slightly above average

Ok suck, average suck, slightly suck......

Feb 7, 2021 0:07:40 GMT -6 @justmy2cents said:

I will give our team credit though on playing to strengths lately Cousins, Keenum, Teddy, Bradford.

It's astonishing how well we did with so many different QBs.

Last Edit: Feb 7, 2021 0:19:03 GMT -6 by vikingpwr

Deleted
Ghosted Member

Posts: 0
Likes:

DeShaun Watson - Should we trade for him? Feb 7, 2021 0:19:12 GMT -6

Quote

Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2021 0:19:12 GMT -6

It's a pipe dream though because he not coming. Because we like conservative instead of letting our nuts hang. I see no reason why he wouldn't be kicking the door down to come to us with our weapons, but then I wake up from dreaming. Remember our identity and remember Zimmer ball la la la as the world turns 🤦🏾‍♂️.

Last Edit: Feb 7, 2021 0:20:53 GMT -6 by Deleted