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vikingpitbull
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Post by vikingpitbull on Dec 5, 2020 15:20:08 GMT -6

Dec 5, 2020 14:54:10 GMT -6 Raptorman said:

Dec 5, 2020 13:18:53 GMT -6 vikingpitbull said:

Nice spin by averages. Try again. Did you ever watch any Vikings game in that era? Didn't thinks so. I know you think you're cool diving into work that others accumulate for you. Instead of average try each year separately. Actually don't use stats use another criteria like real world results.

Okay smartass. Tell us why do the Packers who one of the Greatest QB's in history only have one Super Bowl victory during his run? After All, according to you, a great QB can overcome a Bad Defense. So explain why the Packers and Rodgers only have one Super Bowl victory, which happens to coincide with their Defense only giving up 15 ppg. Put up, or shut up.

So here their PPG on defense during Rodgers tenure. Tell us, what year did Rodgers overcome a Bad defense to win a Super Bowl?

Year	PPG	 W  L  T

2019	20	13  3	0
2018	25	 6  9	0
2017	24	 7  9	0
2016	24      10  6	0
2015	20      10  6	0
2014	22      12  4	0
2013	27       8  7	1
2012	21      11  5	0
2011	22      15  1	0
2010	15      10  6	0
2009	19      11  5	0
2008	24       6 10	0

And BTW, I've seen almost every Vikings game since 1966.

OK dumb ass read this

Actually don't use stats use another criteria like real world results.

WTF are you even copy and pasting? W/L

Last Edit: Dec 5, 2020 15:23:56 GMT -6 by vikingpitbull

Danchat
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Ownership Dec 5, 2020 15:34:22 GMT -6

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Post by Danchat on Dec 5, 2020 15:34:22 GMT -6

Dec 5, 2020 15:20:08 GMT -6 vikingpitbull said:

Dec 5, 2020 14:54:10 GMT -6 Raptorman said:

Okay smartass. Tell us why do the Packers who one of the Greatest QB's in history only have one Super Bowl victory during his run? After All, according to you, a great QB can overcome a Bad Defense. So explain why the Packers and Rodgers only have one Super Bowl victory, which happens to coincide with their Defense only giving up 15 ppg. Put up, or shut up.

So here their PPG on defense during Rodgers tenure. Tell us, what year did Rodgers overcome a Bad defense to win a Super Bowl?

Year	PPG	 W  L  T

2019	20	13  3	0
2018	25	 6  9	0
2017	24	 7  9	0
2016	24      10  6	0
2015	20      10  6	0
2014	22      12  4	0
2013	27       8  7	1
2012	21      11  5	0
2011	22      15  1	0
2010	15      10  6	0
2009	19      11  5	0
2008	24       6 10	0

And BTW, I've seen almost every Vikings game since 1966.

OK dumb ass read this

Actually don't use stats use another criteria like real world results.

WTF are you even copy and pasting? W/L

How about you try providing stats to prove your arguments for a change? This happens nearly every time someone tries to make a counterpoint against you. How about you stop dodging Raptorman's question of "why can't Rodgers win a SB without a great defense"?

vikingpitbull
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Post by vikingpitbull on Dec 5, 2020 15:37:44 GMT -6

Dec 5, 2020 15:34:22 GMT -6 Danchat said:

Dec 5, 2020 15:20:08 GMT -6 vikingpitbull said:

OK dumb ass read this

Actually don't use stats use another criteria like real world results.

WTF are you even copy and pasting? W/L

How about you try providing stats to prove your arguments for a change? This happens nearly every time someone tries to make a counterpoint against you. How about you stop dodging Raptorman's question of "why can't Rodgers win a SB without a great defense"?

He did and who are you?

In 2010, he led them to a victory in Super Bowl XLV over the Pittsburgh Steelers, earning the Super Bowl MVP.

By the way cherry picked stats prove nothing and I have told you that as well. Why would I waste time debating something that has no merit to begin with. Unlike you I have better things to do then act smarter then everyone with a spread sheet.

So let me ask you this. What QB has Minnesota had that where better? Do you need stats for that?

Last Edit: Dec 5, 2020 15:45:31 GMT -6 by vikingpitbull

vikingpitbull
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Post by vikingpitbull on Dec 5, 2020 16:09:22 GMT -6

Here are some copy and paste

Rodgers’ quarterback ratings for the last three seasons have been 95.4 in 2019, 97.6 in 2018 and 97.2 in 2017. Over that span, he has thrown for 10,119 yards, 67 touchdowns and just 12 interceptions.

Rodgers Still Leads Comebacks and Late Drives

Rodgers continues to find ways to lead the team to victories in close games. Last season, the California alum led the Packers to three game winning drives including two comebacks in the fourth quarter. In 2018, he had three more.

Rodgers remains strong in the clutch. The Packers were 9-1 this season including playoffs in one score games and Rodgers was certainly a big reason for that success.

Rodgers Doesn’t Throw Interceptions

Aaron Rodgers has a career interception percentage of 1.4. Over the past two seasons, that number has gone down. Over the past two seasons, Rodgers has thrown six total interceptions in 1,166 pass attempts. That is roughly a 0.5 percent interception percentage, well below his career mark of 1.4.

Keep in mind, the NFL record for most interceptions thrown in a single game is seven, held by Ken Stabler, Steve DeBerg and Ty Detmer. Rodgers hasn’t even thrown that many picks total in the past two seasons.

Rodgers doesn’t give the ball to the opposition and in the modern era where offenses are so explosive and efficient, that’s a huge plus. It’s also the biggest difference between Rodgers and his predecessor.

Is that what you are wanting Danchump? AKA Mr Sizzle

Guess that proves how great he is vs his D. You know because you can get everything above. It's complete. Maybe I needed to put it in columns from Pro Football Reference to make it the end all of loose end stats?

Last Edit: Dec 5, 2020 16:26:12 GMT -6 by vikingpitbull

vikecycle
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Post by vikecycle on Dec 5, 2020 16:46:06 GMT -6

Dec 5, 2020 15:20:08 GMT -6 vikingpitbull said:

Dec 5, 2020 14:54:10 GMT -6 Raptorman said:

Okay smartass. Tell us why do the Packers who one of the Greatest QB's in history only have one Super Bowl victory during his run? After All, according to you, a great QB can overcome a Bad Defense. So explain why the Packers and Rodgers only have one Super Bowl victory, which happens to coincide with their Defense only giving up 15 ppg. Put up, or shut up.

So here their PPG on defense during Rodgers tenure. Tell us, what year did Rodgers overcome a Bad defense to win a Super Bowl?

Year	PPG	 W  L  T

2019	20	13  3	0
2018	25	 6  9	0
2017	24	 7  9	0
2016	24      10  6	0
2015	20      10  6	0
2014	22      12  4	0
2013	27       8  7	1
2012	21      11  5	0
2011	22      15  1	0
2010	15      10  6	0
2009	19      11  5	0
2008	24       6 10	0

And BTW, I've seen almost every Vikings game since 1966.

OK dumb ass read this

Actually don't use stats use another criteria like real world results.

WTF are you even copy and pasting? W/L

I dont understand.

If the argument from Raptor is that Rodgers would have had more rings and/or wins if he had good defenses, then appealing to his W/L record or rings wont help you refute that position.

We judge players by on field production if themselves, not the on field production of their team.

"Hey Hey! Cheer up!

Our Sich Riflemen came out, to a bloody fray

To free our fellow Ukrainians from the shackles of Moscow"

vikecycle
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Post by vikecycle on Dec 5, 2020 16:47:13 GMT -6

Dec 5, 2020 15:37:44 GMT -6 vikingpitbull said:

Dec 5, 2020 15:34:22 GMT -6 Danchat said:

How about you try providing stats to prove your arguments for a change? This happens nearly every time someone tries to make a counterpoint against you. How about you stop dodging Raptorman's question of "why can't Rodgers win a SB without a great defense"?

He did and who are you?

In 2010, he led them to a victory in Super Bowl XLV over the Pittsburgh Steelers, earning the Super Bowl MVP.

By the way cherry picked stats prove nothing and I have told you that as well. Why would I waste time debating something that has no merit to begin with. Unlike you I have better things to do then act smarter then everyone with a spread sheet.

So let me ask you this. What QB has Minnesota had that where better? Do you need stats for that?

The Packers had a top 3 D in 2010. I think Rodgers is literally the GOAT (maybe pending Mahomes), but what Raptor says has merit.

Last Edit: Dec 5, 2020 16:47:32 GMT -6 by vikecycle

"Hey Hey! Cheer up!

Our Sich Riflemen came out, to a bloody fray

To free our fellow Ukrainians from the shackles of Moscow"

vikecycle
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Post by vikecycle on Dec 5, 2020 16:50:43 GMT -6

Dec 4, 2020 20:06:30 GMT -6 Raptorman said:

Dec 4, 2020 19:38:56 GMT -6 @aussie61 said:

Culpepper was taken in the 1st round,but I said:

Of those,3 have been taken this century (Jackson,Ponder,Bridgewater)

1999 was last century *thumb_up*

There's no argument Culpepper had a great season statistically,but the Vikings went 8-8,finishing 2nd in the division to Favre and the Packers.

So to answer the second part of your question,Favre also had a good year statistically and won the division,so using your logic the Packers shouldn't have been in the market for a 1st round QB either.

The difference here,and the whole point of my post,is about talent evaluation,especially at the QB position.Green Bay saw a QB with franchise potential and drafted him,even though they didn't intend to start him immediately.

Just the same as Kansas City saw a QB with franchise potential with Patrick Mahomes and drafted him,even though they had Alex Smith under contract and were coming off a 10-6 season and a playoff berth and never had a losing season with Smith.

Houston saw a QB with franchise potential and moved up to get him and have just cemented Watson as their long term QB.

Talent evaluation at the QB position is sadly lacking,and has been for years.

Green Bay has drafted 2 HOF QB's in 80 years. Bart Starr and Aaron Rodgers. Don't make them out to be some QB knowledgeable team, because they aren't. No one is. It's a crap shoot.

Drafted Starr, Rodgers, Brunnel, Hasslebeck, traded for Favre, had Kurt Warner and Taysom Hill through their preseason system etc. Not to mention, Lynn Dickey had a good GB tenure, as Majikowski qualified as solid for the time.

They clearly are. Im pretty sure three modern era HOFers is more then enough to qualify. Not to pre modern era HOFer Arnie Herber.

"Hey Hey! Cheer up!

Our Sich Riflemen came out, to a bloody fray

To free our fellow Ukrainians from the shackles of Moscow"

Minniman Moderator Posts: 13,640 Likes: 8,137	Ownership Dec 5, 2020 16:51:36 GMT -6 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by Minniman on Dec 5, 2020 16:51:36 GMT -6
	Last Edit: Dec 5, 2020 16:52:58 GMT -6 by Minniman Logic is the beginning of wisdom - not the end.

vikingpitbull
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Post by vikingpitbull on Dec 5, 2020 16:59:06 GMT -6

Dec 5, 2020 16:47:13 GMT -6 vikecycle said:

Dec 5, 2020 15:37:44 GMT -6 vikingpitbull said:

He did and who are you?

In 2010, he led them to a victory in Super Bowl XLV over the Pittsburgh Steelers, earning the Super Bowl MVP.

By the way cherry picked stats prove nothing and I have told you that as well. Why would I waste time debating something that has no merit to begin with. Unlike you I have better things to do then act smarter then everyone with a spread sheet.

So let me ask you this. What QB has Minnesota had that where better? Do you need stats for that?

The Packers had a top 3 D in 2010. I think Rodgers is literally the GOAT (maybe pending Mahomes), but what Raptor says has merit.

Care to look at what I stated about the 98 Vikings? There is merit and there isn't. How many moving parts do you want to include to figure it out? The argument is we wouldn't be better off with Rodgers over the same span as the QBs I listed. If people think otherwise please speak up.

Last Edit: Dec 5, 2020 17:02:21 GMT -6 by vikingpitbull

Minniman
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Post by Minniman on Dec 5, 2020 17:10:30 GMT -6

Dec 5, 2020 16:47:13 GMT -6 vikecycle said:

Dec 5, 2020 15:37:44 GMT -6 vikingpitbull said:

He did and who are you?

In 2010, he led them to a victory in Super Bowl XLV over the Pittsburgh Steelers, earning the Super Bowl MVP.

By the way cherry picked stats prove nothing and I have told you that as well. Why would I waste time debating something that has no merit to begin with. Unlike you I have better things to do then act smarter then everyone with a spread sheet.

So let me ask you this. What QB has Minnesota had that where better? Do you need stats for that?

The Packers had a top 3 D in 2010. I think Rodgers is literally the GOAT (maybe pending Mahomes), but what Raptor says has merit.

Rodgers ... passed up TWICE by the Vikings, and Mahomes had Minnesota connections through his father and the Twins, but the Vikings didn't have a first round pick to play with thanks to Spielman getting dicked in the Philly trade.

Logic is the beginning of wisdom - not the end.

Danchat
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Post by Danchat on Dec 5, 2020 17:20:32 GMT -6

Dec 5, 2020 16:09:22 GMT -6 vikingpitbull said:

Is that what you are wanting Danchump? AKA Mr Sizzle

Resorting to name-calling, I see... very mature. And no, that's not what I wanted. Raptorman asked you this:

Tell us why do the Packers who one of the Greatest QB's in history only have one Super Bowl victory during his run? After All, according to you, a great QB can overcome a Bad Defense. So explain why the Packers and Rodgers only have one Super Bowl victory, which happens to coincide with their Defense only giving up 15 ppg. Put up, or shut up.

And you responded by posting a article that shows reasons why Rodgers is a great QB. But you failed to address the fact that he's only won a single SB, which vikecycle has pointed out that just so happened to occur with a top 3 defense. *skeptic*

vikingpitbull
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Post by vikingpitbull on Dec 5, 2020 17:42:37 GMT -6

Dec 5, 2020 17:20:32 GMT -6 Danchat said:

Dec 5, 2020 16:09:22 GMT -6 vikingpitbull said:

Is that what you are wanting Danchump? AKA Mr Sizzle

Resorting to name-calling, I see... very mature. And no, that's not what I wanted. Raptorman asked you this:

Tell us why do the Packers who one of the Greatest QB's in history only have one Super Bowl victory during his run? After All, according to you, a great QB can overcome a Bad Defense. So explain why the Packers and Rodgers only have one Super Bowl victory, which happens to coincide with their Defense only giving up 15 ppg. Put up, or shut up.

And you responded by posting a article that shows reasons why Rodgers is a great QB. But you failed to address the fact that he's only won a single SB, which vikecycle has pointed out that just so happened to occur with a top 3 defense. *skeptic*

And it has been answered yet neither of you can digest the answer because it's not in spread sheet copy paste form.

How long did it take you to send him all your free data?

Last Edit: Dec 5, 2020 17:43:28 GMT -6 by vikingpitbull

suncoastvike
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Post by suncoastvike on Dec 5, 2020 18:29:40 GMT -6

Dec 5, 2020 16:09:22 GMT -6 vikingpitbull said:

Here are some copy and paste

Rodgers’ quarterback ratings for the last three seasons have been 95.4 in 2019, 97.6 in 2018 and 97.2 in 2017. Over that span, he has thrown for 10,119 yards, 67 touchdowns and just 12 interceptions.

Rodgers Still Leads Comebacks and Late Drives

Rodgers continues to find ways to lead the team to victories in close games. Last season, the California alum led the Packers to three game winning drives including two comebacks in the fourth quarter. In 2018, he had three more.

Rodgers remains strong in the clutch. The Packers were 9-1 this season including playoffs in one score games and Rodgers was certainly a big reason for that success.

Rodgers Doesn’t Throw Interceptions

Aaron Rodgers has a career interception percentage of 1.4. Over the past two seasons, that number has gone down. Over the past two seasons, Rodgers has thrown six total interceptions in 1,166 pass attempts. That is roughly a 0.5 percent interception percentage, well below his career mark of 1.4.

Keep in mind, the NFL record for most interceptions thrown in a single game is seven, held by Ken Stabler, Steve DeBerg and Ty Detmer. Rodgers hasn’t even thrown that many picks total in the past two seasons.

Rodgers doesn’t give the ball to the opposition and in the modern era where offenses are so explosive and efficient, that’s a huge plus. It’s also the biggest difference between Rodgers and his predecessor.

Is that what you are wanting Danchump? AKA Mr Sizzle

Guess that proves how great he is vs his D. You know because you can get everything above. It's complete. Maybe I needed to put it in columns from Pro Football Reference to make it the end all of loose end stats?

...but it's ok that I still hate that whining Rodgers guy right?

If being a Viking fan was easy ~ everyone would do it.

vikingpitbull
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Post by vikingpitbull on Dec 5, 2020 19:05:22 GMT -6

Dec 5, 2020 18:29:40 GMT -6 suncoastvike said:

Dec 5, 2020 16:09:22 GMT -6 vikingpitbull said:

Here are some copy and paste

Rodgers’ quarterback ratings for the last three seasons have been 95.4 in 2019, 97.6 in 2018 and 97.2 in 2017. Over that span, he has thrown for 10,119 yards, 67 touchdowns and just 12 interceptions.

Rodgers Still Leads Comebacks and Late Drives

Rodgers continues to find ways to lead the team to victories in close games. Last season, the California alum led the Packers to three game winning drives including two comebacks in the fourth quarter. In 2018, he had three more.

Rodgers remains strong in the clutch. The Packers were 9-1 this season including playoffs in one score games and Rodgers was certainly a big reason for that success.

Rodgers Doesn’t Throw Interceptions

Aaron Rodgers has a career interception percentage of 1.4. Over the past two seasons, that number has gone down. Over the past two seasons, Rodgers has thrown six total interceptions in 1,166 pass attempts. That is roughly a 0.5 percent interception percentage, well below his career mark of 1.4.

Keep in mind, the NFL record for most interceptions thrown in a single game is seven, held by Ken Stabler, Steve DeBerg and Ty Detmer. Rodgers hasn’t even thrown that many picks total in the past two seasons.

Rodgers doesn’t give the ball to the opposition and in the modern era where offenses are so explosive and efficient, that’s a huge plus. It’s also the biggest difference between Rodgers and his predecessor.

Is that what you are wanting Danchump? AKA Mr Sizzle

Guess that proves how great he is vs his D. You know because you can get everything above. It's complete. Maybe I needed to put it in columns from Pro Football Reference to make it the end all of loose end stats?

...but it's ok that I still hate that whining Rodgers guy right?

Oh yeah. Even more because of.

mikenessfan
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Post by mikenessfan on Dec 5, 2020 23:16:50 GMT -6

I mean if you have a franchise qb, you are going to be in a position every season to compete for a sb and if you don’t have one than literally the whole rest of the team has to be above average with most parts being good to great and the qb can’t be bad. The point is if you have an elite qb, it is much easier to compete for the sb and do it (key word) consistently. So a team like ours that has a gm who struggles finding a franchise qb, has to make sure that all the rest of the team is in top form or as close as we can make it. That is really hard to do consistently.

I hate the packers so much, but I have a respect for them as they know what they are doing on the qb side. Just look at their last draft for a perfect example. They know Rodgers doesn’t have that many more seasons (at least as an elite qb) left in him. So what do they do? They take a kid in Love who has most of the physical traits you look for in today’s qb. He is mobile, athletic, has a good strong arm and is a leader (or was in ncaa). He had some things from college that make him a project imo, but they got ahead of that by letting him sit for a year or possibly 2 and develop him. They may possibly have another franchise qb on their team behind Rodgers. How much would that absolutely suck!? But they are obviously smart about their qb approach and process. Unfortunately we don’t have that on our side.