Is there a QB debate?

Oracle Bone Diviner
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Is there a QB debate? Nov 27, 2023 8:30:25 GMT -6

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Post by Oracle Bone Diviner on Nov 27, 2023 8:30:25 GMT -6

Nov 27, 2023 5:35:26 GMT -6 slapnut19 said:

Nov 26, 2023 20:59:30 GMT -6 Oracle Bone Diviner said:

Have you seen something in Mullens history or his time here that makes you think he has higher upside? You have made a big deal out the fact that Hall was drafted in the 5th round. Mullens wasn't drafted any higher you know...he wasn't even drafted in the 6th, or 7th. If someone drafted in the 5th round can't make it, how can someone who was undrafted?

the difference is Mullens has been in the league since 2018 and is a better option for THIS season. This season matters to me. We aren't tanking either naturally or forced. I want to win as much as possible and see what happens in the playoffs and imo Dobbs or Mullens gives us a better chance to do that. Just let Hall develop and see what he becomes. If he somehow becomes a starter then cool but that doesn’t have to be figured out right now

What is your evidence that Mullens is a better option now? If being in the league longer is the metric, we should play Mannion. Is it is 5-12 record? His 27/23 TD/INT ratio? His ability to get injured without even playing? I just don't see whatever you are seeing. I don't think Mullens is a bad backup, but I can't find any reason but inexplicable bias to think he's obviously a better option. He has no playoff experience, and there's nothing in his history to suggest he can win at that level.

I think Dobbs has earned the right to start this week but he hasn't earned the rest of the season or proved he is playoff caliber yet. Maybe he will and I'm fine with that if he does, but it shouldn't be handed to him unless he plays at a high level.

Last Edit: Nov 27, 2023 8:31:33 GMT -6 by Oracle Bone Diviner

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whoskmoon
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Is there a QB debate? Nov 27, 2023 9:23:11 GMT -6 via mobile Josey Wales likes this

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Post by whoskmoon on Nov 27, 2023 9:23:11 GMT -6

Nov 27, 2023 8:03:37 GMT -6 PurpleFloyd said:

Nov 26, 2023 15:11:46 GMT -6 VFL said:

The mobility issues are still there. Perhaps even more so being a year older coupled with the achilles injury.

He doesn’t have a “lack of mobility “. He can move just fine. He is standing in the pocket giving his playmakers every second he can to get open.

He has been one of the best play action QBs in the league for years and can throw very well on the run but KOC isn’t calling those plays.

Play action does not require good mobility and KOC called more play action than any other OC Cousins has ever had.

FSUVike
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Is there a QB debate? Nov 27, 2023 11:28:16 GMT -6 via mobile Josey Wales likes this

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Post by FSUVike on Nov 27, 2023 11:28:16 GMT -6

Nov 26, 2023 19:15:57 GMT -6 Oracle Bone Diviner said:

Nov 26, 2023 17:05:27 GMT -6 FSUVike said:

His age has zero to do with any single thing I mentioned about why he likely isn't ready yet.

It has everything to do with the point I made.

Hall's upside is QB2. Only delusional fans think finding out a 5th Round developmental/project player is or isn't a QB1 during his Rookie season is somehow more important than trying to do what every single employee of the entire organization has wanted since before the season started: making are Playoffs.

Hall's upside might not even be QB2, it might be Practice Squad, or missionary in the Democratic Republic of Congo. Normally I would say they have to play him to find out, but I now realize we have you and your infallible powers of prognostication to save us the trouble.

Someone has to counterbalance your hot takes and I'm happy to help!

oldman Veteran Dont have any expectations and you will not be disappointed. Posts: 1,432 Likes: 569 Fan Since: 1960	Is there a QB debate? Nov 27, 2023 12:20:22 GMT -6 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by oldman on Nov 27, 2023 12:20:22 GMT -6 Carolina just fired Reich, had Bryce Young and he don't look good. They could of had Stroud and he is balling. What will the vikes do for the next QB?

andhesloose28
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Is there a QB debate? Nov 27, 2023 12:41:50 GMT -6 Oracle Bone Diviner and Josey Wales like this

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Post by andhesloose28 on Nov 27, 2023 12:41:50 GMT -6

Nov 26, 2023 19:45:50 GMT -6 slapnut19 said:

Nov 26, 2023 19:15:57 GMT -6 Oracle Bone Diviner said:

It has everything to do with the point I made.

Hall's upside might not even be QB2, it might be Practice Squad, or missionary in the Democratic Republic of Congo. Normally I would say they have to play him to find out, but I now realize we have you and your infallible powers of prognostication to save us the trouble.

I understand the desire to see a qb we drafted play but I'm also realistic when it comes to Hall. If he earns his way on the field that's cool but I don't think he should be given extensive playing time just because.

I dont think he deserves anything tbh, thats not why i want to see him. I honestly think he could be a better option for the TEAM this year than Dobbs or Mullens. Dobbs is a great story, but he really hasnt played that well overall especially if he is going to play like he did in Denver. Hes not a pocket passer, not sure if that is Kevin or Dobbs but if he doesnt wanna utilize his legs he has no place in this league. When he did he scored two TDs. I think Hall is the perfect in between of Dobbs and Cousins. Ill say it again KOC is the breadwinner here, these are just puppets to him. I think Hall can be that puppet.

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Is there a QB debate? Nov 27, 2023 13:15:00 GMT -6 via mobile andhesloose28 and Josey Wales like this

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Post by whoskmoon on Nov 27, 2023 13:15:00 GMT -6

Nov 27, 2023 12:41:50 GMT -6 andhesloose28 said:

Nov 26, 2023 19:45:50 GMT -6 slapnut19 said:

I understand the desire to see a qb we drafted play but I'm also realistic when it comes to Hall. If he earns his way on the field that's cool but I don't think he should be given extensive playing time just because.

I dont think he deserves anything tbh, thats not why i want to see him. I honestly think he could be a better option for the TEAM this year than Dobbs or Mullens. Dobbs is a great story, but he really hasnt played that well overall especially if he is going to play like he did in Denver. Hes not a pocket passer, not sure if that is Kevin or Dobbs but if he doesnt wanna utilize his legs he has no place in this league. When he did he scored two TDs. I think Hall is the perfect in between of Dobbs and Cousins. Ill say it again KOC is the breadwinner here, these are just puppets to him. I think Hall can be that puppet.

I would like to see a little RPO added in and maybe we see a lot more of that after the bye when they have a couple of weeks to install more plays.

Last Edit: Nov 27, 2023 13:15:45 GMT -6 by whoskmoon

andhesloose28
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Is there a QB debate? Nov 27, 2023 13:51:45 GMT -6

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Post by andhesloose28 on Nov 27, 2023 13:51:45 GMT -6

Nov 27, 2023 13:15:00 GMT -6 whoskmoon said:

Nov 27, 2023 12:41:50 GMT -6 andhesloose28 said:

I dont think he deserves anything tbh, thats not why i want to see him. I honestly think he could be a better option for the TEAM this year than Dobbs or Mullens. Dobbs is a great story, but he really hasnt played that well overall especially if he is going to play like he did in Denver. Hes not a pocket passer, not sure if that is Kevin or Dobbs but if he doesnt wanna utilize his legs he has no place in this league. When he did he scored two TDs. I think Hall is the perfect in between of Dobbs and Cousins. Ill say it again KOC is the breadwinner here, these are just puppets to him. I think Hall can be that puppet.

I would like to see a little RPO added in and maybe we see a lot more of that after the bye when they have a couple of weeks to install more plays.

Yeah agreed, I think that toss run my have scared him or Kevin idk. But there should be minimum 3-4 designed run plays for him. It was frustrating to watch, I understand we still should've won but I want to see him moving more. Hes not a pocket passer.

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Is there a QB debate? Nov 27, 2023 14:06:13 GMT -6

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Post by vikingpwr on Nov 27, 2023 14:06:13 GMT -6

Nov 27, 2023 8:03:37 GMT -6 PurpleFloyd said:

Nov 26, 2023 15:11:46 GMT -6 VFL said:

The mobility issues are still there. Perhaps even more so being a year older coupled with the achilles injury.

He doesn’t have a “lack of mobility “. He can move just fine. He is standing in the pocket giving his playmakers every second he can to get open.

He has been one of the best play action QBs in the league for years and can throw very well on the run but KOC isn’t calling those plays.

Kirk Cousins does not move just fine! As soon as pressure moves him off his spot while he's giving his playmakers that extra second to get open he is good as dead. He's awkward and has a tendency to turn his back and run away from the line of scrimmage.

mngopher35
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Is there a QB debate? Nov 27, 2023 14:51:14 GMT -6 via mobile

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Post by mngopher35 on Nov 27, 2023 14:51:14 GMT -6

Nov 26, 2023 13:25:52 GMT -6 vikingpwr said:

Nov 25, 2023 14:03:07 GMT -6 mngopher35 said:

Their D is what really separates us, if we could match that we would be contenders every year too. That will take time and resources if we want to get to that level.

We hired Brian Flores to get our D up to snuff and the results speak for themselves. Flores is getting more out of this unit than fans originally thought he would. It's not just Danelle Hunter and a bunch of scrubs.

So far the team is slowly improving and when we finally do get a good, young QB he'll have a solid, competitive team under him.

I agree Flores is getting much more out of this defense but at the same time it also doesn’t seem like a top 5 unit despite that and it comes down to talent. While it’s not only scrubs around Hunter there also are some clear issues, like dline and cb play as more obvious holes. Flores is showing that good coaching can make them look average which is better than most expected but doesn’t change the issues around talent.

The team has been improved the last two years and coaching is a big part of it for sure. That’s a little different than the team “slowly improving” and it isn’t necessarily due to talent being brought in making the biggest impacts either. That’s where the gm needs to start doing a better job. I was highlighting that we need more talent to really improve to the next level and that will take resources. No need to waste more resources on a qb that leads to similar results offensively as min level backups on either side. Use those resources to truly build up the defense like I was getting at instead.

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Is there a QB debate? Nov 27, 2023 15:14:43 GMT -6 via mobile Danchat and slapnut19 like this

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Post by FSUVike on Nov 27, 2023 15:14:43 GMT -6

Nov 27, 2023 12:41:50 GMT -6 andhesloose28 said:

Nov 26, 2023 19:45:50 GMT -6 slapnut19 said:

I understand the desire to see a qb we drafted play but I'm also realistic when it comes to Hall. If he earns his way on the field that's cool but I don't think he should be given extensive playing time just because.

I dont think he deserves anything tbh, thats not why i want to see him. I honestly think he could be a better option for the TEAM this year than Dobbs or Mullens. Dobbs is a great story, but he really hasnt played that well overall especially if he is going to play like he did in Denver. Hes not a pocket passer, not sure if that is Kevin or Dobbs but if he doesnt wanna utilize his legs he has no place in this league. When he did he scored two TDs. I think Hall is the perfect in between of Dobbs and Cousins. Ill say it again KOC is the breadwinner here, these are just puppets to him. I think Hall can be that puppet.

We trust KOC to develop a QBOTF after seeing Kirk in Year 2, Dobbs with zero prep and 1 good series from Hall.

But then we don't trust him when he sticks with Hobbs and elevates Mullens over Hall?

Fans need to make up their minds. I'll say it again and again and again if need be: he didn't take snaps from under Center in College. Minnesota runs near the top of the League in snaps from under Center.

Hall has to learn to read Defenses from literally the opposite perspective than he was used to. While learning a Playbook that long-time veterans struggled to pick up in a single offseason. With legit 5th Round talent. And no running game.

Frankly, it would be shocking if Kevin thought Hall gave Minnesota a better chance of winning. Or that throwing Hall in the deep end was in any conceivable way conducive to his development.

Clearly, he does not. Preferring to roll with journeyman QBs. Because he knows the kid simply isn't ready yet. And starting him now would damage his development while also ruining all the hard work his Team put in to salvage their season.

We as fans want to see the next Brock Purdy because we've suffered long enough. And we want to see him now. Fortunately, Kevin O'Connell has a more realistic and long-term view of the situation.

Last Edit: Nov 27, 2023 15:16:12 GMT -6 by FSUVike

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Is there a QB debate? Nov 27, 2023 15:45:25 GMT -6 PurpleKoolaid likes this

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Post by VFL on Nov 27, 2023 15:45:25 GMT -6

Nov 27, 2023 8:03:37 GMT -6 PurpleFloyd said:

Nov 26, 2023 15:11:46 GMT -6 VFL said:

The mobility issues are still there. Perhaps even more so being a year older coupled with the achilles injury.

He doesn’t have a “lack of mobility “. He can move just fine. He is standing in the pocket giving his playmakers every second he can to get open.

He has been one of the best play action QBs in the league for years and can throw very well on the run but KOC isn’t calling those plays.

Any NFL analyst will tell you he is not very mobile. I hear it every day from multiple shows on NFL SiriusXM as an example. He does not move fine. He is slow and lacks the twitch muscles for quick bursts.

Play action is only a fake handoff and drop back to pass. It is not a move that requires great athleticism or mobility. Throwing on the run is not very indicative of "mobility". The speed and movements in that scenario are the indicator, and Kirk lacks both. I don't believe I've seen anyone say Kirk doesn't have an arm. Throwing on the run would perhaps lean more towards "coordination" and not "mobility".

I think he waits every second in the pocket because HE knows HE lacks the speed, the mobility, and play-making "it" factor to leave the pocket when no receiver is open. Look how awful he looked on that toss behind the head when pressured against the Bears (I believe). Got lucky as hell that wasn't a TO.

You krusaders can defend him all you want on many levels. Mobility is not one of those levels I hate to say.

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Funkytown Owner Purple Pain Big Dog Posts: 67,623 Likes: 31,549 Fan Since: 1998	Is there a QB debate? Nov 27, 2023 17:45:37 GMT -6 via mobile Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by Funkytown on Nov 27, 2023 17:45:37 GMT -6

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Is there a QB debate? Nov 27, 2023 18:45:10 GMT -6 kmillard likes this

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Post by comet52 on Nov 27, 2023 18:45:10 GMT -6

Nov 27, 2023 12:20:22 GMT -6 oldman said:

Carolina just fired Reich, had Bryce Young and he don't look good. They could of had Stroud and he is balling. What will the vikes do for the next QB?

Owner hires Reich, shoves Young down his throat after Reich wanted Stroud, then fires Reich. It must be fun to a be billionaire and do stupid sh*t while the consequences of that stupid sh*t always land on the head of some other guy. David Tepper is dumb as f*ck.

Last Edit: Nov 27, 2023 18:46:49 GMT -6 by comet52

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PurpleFloyd Jersey Retired Posts: 4,366 Likes: 2,094	Is there a QB debate? Nov 27, 2023 19:35:10 GMT -6 via mobile Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by PurpleFloyd on Nov 27, 2023 19:35:10 GMT -6 Nov 27, 2023 17:45:37 GMT -6 Funkytown said: Some rubes are not going to like this and will probably distort some statistics to try and refute it 😁

gophersturf10 Starter Posts: 537 Likes: 203	Is there a QB debate? Nov 27, 2023 20:16:58 GMT -6 via mobile Funkytown, Danchat, and 1 more like this Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by gophersturf10 on Nov 27, 2023 20:16:58 GMT -6 I think it’s nick Mullins time. 😂🤣🤣