So.....Anthony Barr...?

Jor-El
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So.....Anthony Barr...? Apr 12, 2022 9:51:36 GMT -6 suncoastvike likes this

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Post by Jor-El on Apr 12, 2022 9:51:36 GMT -6

Apr 12, 2022 7:44:30 GMT -6 winatnoon said:

In my 50+ years following this ridiculous franchise, Anthony Barr is, without a doubt, it’s most bewildering enigma. He was an enigma at UCLA, flashing incredible athleticism against the contrast of immature football instincts. Zimmer took a shot and got him and......everything he was at UCLA, he was in MN, a great athlete with an incredibly high ceiling but a guy who seemingly lacked the desire to capitalize on his enormous gifts. Personally, I’d rank his athletic attributes in top-five all-time among NFL LBs. Could anyone imagine what Butkus would have done with Barr’s speed, strength and quickness? Would have been illegal.

What strikes me as uniquely enigmatic about Barr is how he clearly underachieved what was possible with his athletic talents, but was never declared an outright bust. There are plenty of athletic freaks who just fail outright because their effort or instincts are lacking and they get cut no later than the end of their rookie contract and bounce around and are soon out of the league. It often seemed like Barr was the same, but only noticed by the fans. According to his coaches, he was the rock of the defense and a superstar.

IMO the post-Zimmer career of Anthony Barr is one of the many studies of just how much BS we were all being fed during the last decade. We all KNOW there was a lot of sugarcoating of lower-end players on the roster: every summer we were told that TJ Clemmings/Willie Beavers/Dru Samia/Oli Udoh had an amazing offseason and was about to emerge from past disappointment. It's obvious Rick Spielman picked a lot of worthless crap after round 2, and some were carried on the roster longer than they deserved to avoid embarrassment even when they were so pathetic they couldn't get on the field.

But my hunch is that he was lousy in the first 2 rounds as well and forced the coaching staff to not only keep those players, but start them and praise them. Bradbury obviously would have been benched by many other teams. How about Barr? Was he kept in the lineup, lauded, and even re-signed, to maintain the illusion of great drafting? Maybe it was bad enough that the #9 overall pick in 2014 will always be "should have chosen Aaron Donald" (or at least Zack Martin or maybe Odell Beckham) - would admitting Rick chose an actual bust have been unbearable shame (not to mention a threat to job security)?

comet52
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So.....Anthony Barr...? Apr 12, 2022 10:11:15 GMT -6

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Post by comet52 on Apr 12, 2022 10:11:15 GMT -6

Apr 12, 2022 9:51:36 GMT -6 Jor-El said:

What strikes me as uniquely enigmatic about Barr is how he clearly underachieved what was possible with his athletic talents, but was never declared an outright bust.

A local contingent of dedicated bloggers worked overtime to sell the notion that Barr was the "secret sauce" of the Mike Zimmer defense and thus was truly great, even though us commoner football fans couldn't possibly see it due to our lack of deep football acumen.

Strangely, most "great" players are widely and readily acknowledged by media, fans, etc. But Barr is only great in the eyes of a few guys who expended a lot of ink trying to sell us on that concept.

Apparently he is/was the most stealthy "great" player in NFL history.

Last Edit: Apr 12, 2022 10:14:52 GMT -6 by comet52

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winatnoon
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So.....Anthony Barr...? Apr 12, 2022 10:50:15 GMT -6 via mobile winatnoon likes this

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Post by winatnoon on Apr 12, 2022 10:50:15 GMT -6

Apr 12, 2022 10:11:15 GMT -6 comet52 said:

Apr 12, 2022 9:51:36 GMT -6 Jor-El said:

What strikes me as uniquely enigmatic about Barr is how he clearly underachieved what was possible with his athletic talents, but was never declared an outright bust.

A local contingent of dedicated bloggers worked overtime to sell the notion that Barr was the "secret sauce" of the Mike Zimmer defense and thus was truly great, even though us commoner football fans couldn't possibly see it due to our lack of deep football acumen.

Strangely, most "great" players are widely and readily acknowledged by media, fans, etc. But Barr is only great in the eyes of a few guys who expended a lot of ink trying to sell us on that concept.

Apparently he is/was the most stealthy "great" player in NFL history.

Exactly! Parcells say about Barr, “You are who the experts and the fans say you are.”

winatnoon
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So.....Anthony Barr...? Apr 12, 2022 10:51:01 GMT -6 via mobile

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Post by winatnoon on Apr 12, 2022 10:51:01 GMT -6

Apr 12, 2022 9:51:36 GMT -6 Jor-El said:

Apr 12, 2022 7:44:30 GMT -6 winatnoon said:

In my 50+ years following this ridiculous franchise, Anthony Barr is, without a doubt, it’s most bewildering enigma. He was an enigma at UCLA, flashing incredible athleticism against the contrast of immature football instincts. Zimmer took a shot and got him and......everything he was at UCLA, he was in MN, a great athlete with an incredibly high ceiling but a guy who seemingly lacked the desire to capitalize on his enormous gifts. Personally, I’d rank his athletic attributes in top-five all-time among NFL LBs. Could anyone imagine what Butkus would have done with Barr’s speed, strength and quickness? Would have been illegal.

What strikes me as uniquely enigmatic about Barr is how he clearly underachieved what was possible with his athletic talents, but was never declared an outright bust. There are plenty of athletic freaks who just fail outright because their effort or instincts are lacking and they get cut no later than the end of their rookie contract and bounce around and are soon out of the league. It often seemed like Barr was the same, but only noticed by the fans. According to his coaches, he was the rock of the defense and a superstar.

IMO the post-Zimmer career of Anthony Barr is one of the many studies of just how much BS we were all being fed during the last decade. We all KNOW there was a lot of sugarcoating of lower-end players on the roster: every summer we were told that TJ Clemmings/Willie Beavers/Dru Samia/Oli Udoh had an amazing offseason and was about to emerge from past disappointment. It's obvious Rick Spielman picked a lot of worthless crap after round 2, and some were carried on the roster longer than they deserved to avoid embarrassment even when they were so pathetic they couldn't get on the field.

But my hunch is that he was lousy in the first 2 rounds as well and forced the coaching staff to not only keep those players, but start them and praise them. Bradbury obviously would have been benched by many other teams. How about Barr? Was he kept in the lineup, lauded, and even re-signed, to maintain the illusion of great drafting? Maybe it was bad enough that the #9 overall pick in 2014 will always be "should have chosen Aaron Donald" (or at least Zack Martin or maybe Odell Beckham) - would admitting Rick chose an actual bust have been unbearable shame (not to mention a threat to job security)?

Good post!

FSUVike
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So.....Anthony Barr...? Apr 12, 2022 12:09:04 GMT -6 via mobile Danchat and Purple Pain like this

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Post by FSUVike on Apr 12, 2022 12:09:04 GMT -6

Yeah, not agreeing at all. Barr did exactly what Zimmer wanted. Exactly. Was he over drafted relative to the role he was miscast in? Undoubtedly. Did we as fans look at the athletic traits and expect more? Unquestionably.

But he was the Signal caller for some good to great Defenses. Wasn't there a year in which the Vikings set the all time record for 3rd Down conversion percentage? And they did that because Barr was an underachiever?

Zimmer needed Barr to do the stuff that doesn't show up in the stat sheets so that he could wield Hitman in so many unique ways while also maximizing Kendricks.

Fans wanted Lawrence Taylor. Mike Zimmer wanted Rey Maualuga. And the HC got what he wanted. With enough results that you could certainly make the argument that he was justified.

I will never blame AB for being exactly what he was asked to be. Getting picked too high for a miscast role is on Slick and Stubborn. And yes, he was unequivocally an essential part of many very good/borderline great Defenses.

Last Edit: Apr 12, 2022 12:10:40 GMT -6 by FSUVike

HunterMorrow
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So.....Anthony Barr...? Apr 12, 2022 12:40:48 GMT -6 PurpleKoolaid and Jor-El like this

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Post by HunterMorrow on Apr 12, 2022 12:40:48 GMT -6

I don't know if I can buy into that, "he did so much stuff that didn't show up on the stat sheet" thing. It seemed like total cope by Spielman and Zimmer for the last 4 years. If he was such the secret sauce being deftly utilized by a defense wizard head coach, why'd we have bottom 10 defenses for the last 2 years? If I was too dumb to see it, they were too foolish to realize it, he was underperforming an overpriced contract and became a pass coverage liability. The rest of the league isn't beating down the doors for Anthony "Stats Schmats, he's Weapon X!" Barr so that tells me a lot.

Edit: And you know, Kirk Cousins really did spoil us in one way the last 4 years. I think he's only missed 3 or 4 games in 4 years. Anthony Barr has missed 20 games in the last 2 seasons. 20! I think the team wants to dish him, but nobody wanted to eat the dish. Hindsight is 20/20, yadda yadda, but I don't think we'd have missed much if that Jets deal went through. Barr is like that Belichick thing where its like, "its better to move off them 2 years too early than 2 years too late" sort of thing. The Vikings retain people past the point of it making sense quite frequently.

Last Edit: Apr 12, 2022 12:47:04 GMT -6 by HunterMorrow

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mngopher35
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So.....Anthony Barr...? Apr 12, 2022 12:53:12 GMT -6 HunterMorrow likes this

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Post by mngopher35 on Apr 12, 2022 12:53:12 GMT -6

Apr 12, 2022 12:40:48 GMT -6 HunterMorrow said:

I don't know if I can buy into that, "he did so much stuff that didn't show up on the stat sheet" thing. It seemed like total cope by Spielman and Zimmer for the last 4 years. If he was such the secret sauce being deftly utilized by a defense wizard head coach, why'd we have bottom 10 defenses for the last 2 years? If I was too dumb to see it, they were too foolish to realize it, he was underperforming an overpriced contract and became a pass coverage liability. The rest of the league isn't beating down the doors for Anthony "Stats Schmats, he's Weapon X!" Barr so that tells me a lot.

Edit: And you know, Kirk Cousins really did spoil us in one way the last 4 years. I think he's only missed 3 or 4 games in 4 years. Anthony Barr has missed 20 games in the last 2 seasons. 20! I think the team wants to dish him, but nobody wanted to eat the dish. Hindsight is 20/20, yadda yadda, but I don't think we'd have missed much if that Jets deal went through. Barr is like that Belichick thing where its like, "its better to move off them 2 years too early than 2 years too late" sort of thing. The Vikings retain people past the point of it making sense quite frequently.

Part of that was injuries, he didn't even play which I see now is in the edit. That's the main issue he had imo and given his age I would think plays a part in his lack of interest. The defense has been bad because we invested/hit more on the offensive side of the ball (yet it is somehow just mediocre despite that). We had limited cap and left our secondary very very weak, once Hunter went down we had no pass rush either (unless via scheme which hurt us elsewhere). I think last year prior to Hunter injury the defense was actually decent, the offense often just went long stretches without showing up.

I do agree we wouldn't have missed him much in the last couple years if we didn't sign him back and let him go to the Jets. I think you can say that about most of our players given what we keep paying them though/injuries/the success it's brought over that time. Prior to the last couple seasons he was pretty productive for us though.

Last Edit: Apr 12, 2022 13:00:27 GMT -6 by mngopher35

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So.....Anthony Barr...? Apr 12, 2022 14:59:01 GMT -6

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Post by Jor-El on Apr 12, 2022 14:59:01 GMT -6

Apr 12, 2022 12:09:04 GMT -6 FSUVike said:

But he was the Signal caller for some good to great Defenses. Wasn't there a year in which the Vikings set the all time record for 3rd Down conversion percentage? And they did that because Barr was an underachiever?

So you're saying that Barr was a "coach on the field"? OK, I know that's a real thing and has value. But do you need to spend the 9th pick in the draft to get it? It seems like the function you hand to a cagey veteran or some overachieving mid-rounder. Maybe Zimmer should have kept Audie Cole or Michael Mauti around and performed a mind-meld to make one be his alter ego in the huddle. We "fans wanted Lawrence Taylor"? Of course we did, it's the NFL and the premier players are world-class athletes who change games with their ability to physically dominate other great athletes. Was Barr some kind of savant of the game? Maybe he should have been playing chess.

Apr 12, 2022 12:09:04 GMT -6 FSUVike said:

I will never blame AB for being exactly what he was asked to be. Getting picked too high for a miscast role is on Slick and Stubborn.

Blame Barr? Not my intent. Incompetent GM and coach if they used that pick to acquire a role player. Yes, he did what was asked of him. But he ultimately was, or became, just a product of the Zimmer system, and that system had a limited effective life and ran its course. Maybe Barr could have been a game-changing LB on a different team, but Mike Zimmer made him a role player tuned for a unique scheme. I think the lack of interest in Barr just shows that the rest of the NFL doubts he can be productive in any other system.

FSUVike
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So.....Anthony Barr...? Apr 12, 2022 17:20:14 GMT -6 via mobile

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Post by FSUVike on Apr 12, 2022 17:20:14 GMT -6

Apr 12, 2022 14:59:01 GMT -6 Jor-El said:

Apr 12, 2022 12:09:04 GMT -6 FSUVike said:

But he was the Signal caller for some good to great Defenses. Wasn't there a year in which the Vikings set the all time record for 3rd Down conversion percentage? And they did that because Barr was an underachiever?

So you're saying that Barr was a "coach on the field"? OK, I know that's a real thing and has value. But do you need to spend the 9th pick in the draft to get it? It seems like the function you hand to a cagey veteran or some overachieving mid-rounder. Maybe Zimmer should have kept Audie Cole or Michael Mauti around and performed a mind-meld to make one be his alter ego in the huddle. We "fans wanted Lawrence Taylor"? Of course we did, it's the NFL and the premier players are world-class athletes who change games with their ability to physically dominate other great athletes. Was Barr some kind of savant of the game? Maybe he should have been playing chess.

Apr 12, 2022 12:09:04 GMT -6 FSUVike said:

I will never blame AB for being exactly what he was asked to be. Getting picked too high for a miscast role is on Slick and Stubborn.

Blame Barr? Not my intent. Incompetent GM and coach if they used that pick to acquire a role player. Yes, he did what was asked of him. But he ultimately was, or became, just a product of the Zimmer system, and that system had a limited effective life and ran its course. Maybe Barr could have been a game-changing LB on a different team, but Mike Zimmer made him a role player tuned for a unique scheme. I think the lack of interest in Barr just shows that the rest of the NFL doubts he can be productive in any other system.

I'm saying he had the green dot. Value that however you like.

He was over drafted for what Zimmer wanted him to do. Frankly, he was over drafted for whatever role he could have played in the NFL. Too raw coming out.

But the notion others have mentioned that his value was chimera is nonsense. OCs knew Barr could come off the edge of blitz up an interior gap. Having not 1 but 2 LBs capable of threatening A Gap blitzes who could both drop at the snap and cover to the sidelines had real value. Barr's run stopping skills had real value. His coverage skills earlier in his career had value.

Number 9 overall pick value? Hell, no. Legit value nonetheless. And he certainly wasn't a bust like 50% of 1st Round picks typically are.

vikingpwr Living Legend Posts: 21,389 Likes: 4,606	So.....Anthony Barr...? Apr 13, 2022 11:57:08 GMT -6 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by vikingpwr on Apr 13, 2022 11:57:08 GMT -6 Apr 11, 2022 7:45:55 GMT -6 comet52 said: Bad knees, career likely over. That's likely the case and I wouldn't want him on our current team. Time to move on. Anthony Barr was a good LB for us....period.

gophersturf10
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So.....Anthony Barr...? Apr 13, 2022 11:58:36 GMT -6 via mobile PurpleKoolaid likes this

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Post by gophersturf10 on Apr 13, 2022 11:58:36 GMT -6

Apr 13, 2022 11:57:08 GMT -6 vikingpwr said:

Apr 11, 2022 7:45:55 GMT -6 comet52 said:

Bad knees, career likely over.

That's likely the case and I wouldn't want him on our current team. Time to move on. Anthony Barr was a good LB for us....period.

He was/is below average.

vikingpwr
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So.....Anthony Barr...? Apr 13, 2022 13:44:59 GMT -6

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Post by vikingpwr on Apr 13, 2022 13:44:59 GMT -6

Apr 13, 2022 11:58:36 GMT -6 gophersturf10 said:

Apr 13, 2022 11:57:08 GMT -6 vikingpwr said:

That's likely the case and I wouldn't want him on our current team. Time to move on. Anthony Barr was a good LB for us....period.

He was/is below average.

Ok

sky4it
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So.....Anthony Barr...? Apr 13, 2022 18:32:58 GMT -6 FSUVike likes this

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Post by sky4it on Apr 13, 2022 18:32:58 GMT -6

Apr 12, 2022 17:20:14 GMT -6 FSUVike said:

Apr 12, 2022 14:59:01 GMT -6 Jor-El said:

So you're saying that Barr was a "coach on the field"? OK, I know that's a real thing and has value. But do you need to spend the 9th pick in the draft to get it? It seems like the function you hand to a cagey veteran or some overachieving mid-rounder. Maybe Zimmer should have kept Audie Cole or Michael Mauti around and performed a mind-meld to make one be his alter ego in the huddle. We "fans wanted Lawrence Taylor"? Of course we did, it's the NFL and the premier players are world-class athletes who change games with their ability to physically dominate other great athletes. Was Barr some kind of savant of the game? Maybe he should have been playing chess.

Blame Barr? Not my intent. Incompetent GM and coach if they used that pick to acquire a role player. Yes, he did what was asked of him. But he ultimately was, or became, just a product of the Zimmer system, and that system had a limited effective life and ran its course. Maybe Barr could have been a game-changing LB on a different team, but Mike Zimmer made him a role player tuned for a unique scheme. I think the lack of interest in Barr just shows that the rest of the NFL doubts he can be productive in any other system.

I'm saying he had the green dot. Value that however you like.

He was over drafted for what Zimmer wanted him to do. Frankly, he was over drafted for whatever role he could have played in the NFL. Too raw coming out.

But the notion others have mentioned that his value was chimera is nonsense. OCs knew Barr could come off the edge of blitz up an interior gap. Having not 1 but 2 LBs capable of threatening A Gap blitzes who could both drop at the snap and cover to the sidelines had real value. Barr's run stopping skills had real value. His coverage skills earlier in his career had value.

Number 9 overall pick value? Hell, no. Legit value nonetheless. And he certainly wasn't a bust like 50% of 1st Round picks typically are.

Agreed he was at least a good pick, and I think proved to be the 9th best player in that draft. I was against Zimmer getting fired, but now that hes gone, I think Barr could have played DE as a pass rusher or rushed from a 3-4 and rang up more stats. Barr was good early in his career at pass defense, and even tho he is less now, he takes up a lot of space with those long strides of his. Made some stellar plays in his career. Its unfair to bash Barr

Purple Pain
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So.....Anthony Barr...? Apr 16, 2022 13:40:09 GMT -6

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Post by Purple Pain on Apr 16, 2022 13:40:09 GMT -6

Anthony Barr Linked to New-but-Familiar Team

This week, former Vikings linebacker Ben Leber speculated injuries might be the cause of Barr’s free-agent quiescence. Perhaps the man has a knee malady too grave for a ninth NFL season. It happens.

In any event, Barr remains a free agent — one that played at a high level in 2021. He alone authored game-changing plays for the Vikings in two games (at Baltimore and vs. Los Angeles Rams) last season, but Minnesota squandered those opportunities. There was a lot of that last season.

In theory, Barr could return to the Vikings, but that outlook is dampened because it likely would’ve happened already. As the depth chart stands two weeks before the NFL Draft, Eric Kendricks and Jordan Hicks are scheduled to fill the off-ball linebacker jobs.

Recently, though, CBS Sports’ Cody Benjamin predicted Barr might land with the New York Jets in free agency — a team that almost acquired Barr in the spring of 2019. At the last minute, Barr lamented the then-imminent decision, changed his mind, and returned to Minnesota for three more years.

Benjamin theorized where 15 of the league’s best remaining free agents might end up, and he explained Barr to the Jets this way:

“Remember when these two almost struck a lucrative free-agent deal before he settled back into Minnesota? Well, with the Vikings adding at LB this year, he could finally relocate to New York and give Robert Saleh’s unit added experience/versatility.“

If Barr is healthy and his knee is much ado about nothing, this indeed checks out. The Jets need linebackers, and Barr was quite productive in 2021.

By this time on the calendar, though, Barr probably wouldn’t command a large contract as was once thought when free agency commenced. The working theory was Barr could net a bigger deal on the open market than with Minnesota, but this utter silence regarding his free agency has changed the projection.

Barr turned 30 in March.

Interestingly, in the same article by Benjamin, he predicted a Minnesota acquisition of Akiem Hicks from the Bears. Yes, the infamous Viking killer.

Link:

purpleptsd.com/anthony-barr-linked-to-new-but-familiar-team/

Last Edit: Apr 16, 2022 13:40:31 GMT -6 by Purple Pain

Purple Pain
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So.....Anthony Barr...? Apr 18, 2022 3:31:04 GMT -6

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Post by Purple Pain on Apr 18, 2022 3:31:04 GMT -6

Purple Insider Mailbag:

@jordan_Fisk Do you think there's any chance Barr comes back? The Smith signing probably significantly lowers the chances. Also do you think there's any realistic chances of signing JC Tretter? I could be wrong but I feel like we have enough money for one of the two.

I would be very surprised if he returned. Kwesi Adofo-Mensah talked about that in his press conference and didn’t really leave the door open for it happening. I don’t think it was the Za’Darius Smith signing that indicated Barr’s time in Minnesota was over, rather adding Jordan Hicks. That’s the role Barr has played for his entire career. At one point, bringing back Barr was worth considering because it would have possibly helped a little with the cap to extend him rather than have the entire dead cap hit just sitting there, but we’ve gone past the time where that was an option. I do think there’s a realistic chance of signing Tretter. Once the draft is over, nobody is getting paid what they are worth. Sheldon Richardson signing for $3.6 million last year is a good example of that. So if nobody is handing out big dollars, Minnesota would be one of the few places that would offer a starting job at center that late in the free agency game.