JJ Watt released

HarryHits22
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JJ Watt released Feb 12, 2021 20:18:38 GMT -6

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Post by HarryHits22 on Feb 12, 2021 20:18:38 GMT -6

Feb 12, 2021 12:45:32 GMT -6 Uncle said:

Feb 12, 2021 12:25:22 GMT -6 HarryHits22 said:

Anytime people discuss FA in the media, they always exclude us for salary cap reasons, yet the Packers are in 20 mil deeper than us and I've never seen a soul bring it up, and they've been linked to various free agents. Weird

The reason is because veterans on the free agent market who have had successful careers but haven't been in contention for a Super Bowl tend to gravitate towards teams that are considered contenders. And regardless of how true it is, the sports media tend to crown the Packers as "contenders" moreso than the Vikings...

...especially since they have the reigning league MVP (Rodgers) playing for them and the Vikings have...well...*cough*...Kirk Cousins.

There probably won't be many free agents (outside those willing to take cheap, "prove-it" deals and cash-in next offseason) that will be rushing towards Winter Park this offseason to play for Zimmer and/or Kirk and get a ring. Just look at Adrian Peterson, who recently stated he'd love to go play for Tampa Bay and try and win a ring with Brady.

The Vikes had media attention as "contenders" before the 2009 season when Chilly took a trip down to Hattiesburg, MS...and then before the 2016 season (before Teddy was injured) when they were the "it" up-and-coming team and then again right before the 2018 season when Kirk was signed to be the missing piece in a Vikings Super Bowl run...that public media "shine" from the 2018 offseason has certainly worn off after 3 years of mostly mediocrity...

I think you missed my point, it's not so much about the media not predicting players to Minnesota, I'm fully aware we are unlikely to sign anyone of note. I just don't get how they can so hypocritically use the salary cap as the reason we won't, meanwhile ignore the fact that the Packers are in way worse cap situation than we are. It doesn't matter if a player wants to play for GB because they are a contender, the Packers are already almost 30 million in the red, they will be purging contracts this offseason, it's highly unlikely that they are buyers in free agency unless they do some miracle book keeping

Last Edit: Feb 12, 2021 20:20:38 GMT -6 by HarryHits22

ozzvic
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JJ Watt released Feb 13, 2021 3:35:43 GMT -6 via mobile

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Post by ozzvic on Feb 13, 2021 3:35:43 GMT -6

He can still be productive but would like him as a rotation guy, with his injury history i dont want to see the Vikings pay him to play 60-70 snaps. If they do then awesome lets go DT in rd 1 and have a killer DL again but i would be holding my breath waiting for him to get hurt.

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JJ Watt released Feb 13, 2021 4:42:20 GMT -6

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Post by Minniman on Feb 13, 2021 4:42:20 GMT -6

Feb 12, 2021 12:49:05 GMT -6 bdillon0820 said:

Steelers (brothers play there), Packers (hometown team) or Chicago (wife plays soccer there).

Really, that's about it.

I'd say it is more like 50% Steelers, 30% Packers, 10% Bears, 10% someplace else.

Logic is the beginning of wisdom - not the end.

HarryHits22
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JJ Watt released Feb 13, 2021 5:29:01 GMT -6 via mobile

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Post by HarryHits22 on Feb 13, 2021 5:29:01 GMT -6

Feb 13, 2021 4:42:20 GMT -6 Minniman said:

Feb 12, 2021 12:49:05 GMT -6 bdillon0820 said:

Steelers (brothers play there), Packers (hometown team) or Chicago (wife plays soccer there).

Really, that's about it.

I'd say it is more like 50% Steelers, 30% Packers, 10% Bears, 10% someplace else.

Pack and pitt are 30 mil in the red. Why people acting like our cap situation is so bad and turn around and pretend like it doesn't exist for other teams in a worse place than us. Bears only have 1 mil savings on us too.

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JJ Watt released Feb 13, 2021 6:33:12 GMT -6

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Post by Minniman on Feb 13, 2021 6:33:12 GMT -6

Feb 13, 2021 5:29:01 GMT -6 HarryHits22 said:

Feb 13, 2021 4:42:20 GMT -6 Minniman said:

Really, that's about it.

I'd say it is more like 50% Steelers, 30% Packers, 10% Bears, 10% someplace else.

Pack and pitt are 30 mil in the red. Why people acting like our cap situation is so bad and turn around and pretend like it doesn't exist for other teams in a worse place than us. Bears only have 1 mil savings on us too.

The Vikings cap situation is bad this year, but next year will be cap hell unless Cousins gets restructured to kick that can down the road. Did Spielman sign that extension when he was drugged up going into an operation? No way you guarantee any player $45 million. The only other player to have a fully guaranteed contract of close to that magnitude was Tom Brady at $25 million each season plus incentives, and many of those were playoffs and Super Bowl incentives.

If Watt wants to go to the Steelers on cap friendly deal, they will likely fit him in with some strategic cuts and restructures they will likely have to make anyway. The Packers would likely have a more difficult time of it. The Bears are in better shape, but their QB situation is unresolved.

Watt asked for his release because he wants to go to a team that is either a contender or has personal ties. He has enough money that he can give some up to go where he wants. If he was chasing dollars on a bad team, he could have stayed in Houston.

Logic is the beginning of wisdom - not the end.

Uncle Content Creator Posts: 7,815 Likes: 11,494	JJ Watt released Feb 14, 2021 9:14:12 GMT -6 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by Uncle on Feb 14, 2021 9:14:12 GMT -6 Here's one way the Packers are creating cap space....

HarryHits22
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JJ Watt released Feb 14, 2021 12:52:09 GMT -6

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Post by HarryHits22 on Feb 14, 2021 12:52:09 GMT -6

Feb 14, 2021 9:14:12 GMT -6 Uncle said:

Here's one way the Packers are creating cap space....

only 20 million more to go to get to 0.... then they need another what... 6-8 mill for draft picks.... and then some more to actually start making actual additions, assuming they're going to let their 4-5 notable free agents walk and have no young players in line for extensions.

Just so I can get a clear take here, because I believe the Vikings cap situation IS quite detrimental to the team this year and next year, and I thought that was a widely held belief around here. Is that the case, or do you believe that the salary cap is easily manipulated for teams to do as they please, leaving the Packers as strong contenders in free agency this year?

Uncle
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JJ Watt released Feb 14, 2021 16:05:52 GMT -6 vikingpwr likes this

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Post by Uncle on Feb 14, 2021 16:05:52 GMT -6

Feb 14, 2021 12:52:09 GMT -6 HarryHits22 said:

Feb 14, 2021 9:14:12 GMT -6 Uncle said:

Here's one way the Packers are creating cap space....

only 20 million more to go to get to 0.... then they need another what... 6-8 mill for draft picks.... and then some more to actually start making actual additions, assuming they're going to let their 4-5 notable free agents walk and have no young players in line for extensions.

Just so I can get a clear take here, because I believe the Vikings cap situation IS quite detrimental to the team this year and next year, and I thought that was a widely held belief around here. Is that the case, or do you believe that the salary cap is easily manipulated for teams to do as they please, leaving the Packers as strong contenders in free agency this year?

I think the cap is easily manipulated enough for those those teams that 1) know what they're doing and how to do it, and 2) are considered contenders which can create a "want to" among its players to restructure their contracts if it helps the team keep/sign free agents. You don't see too much can manipulation/restructuring among teams like Jacksonville and Detroit whereas we've seen it from the Rams, Saints and other "contenders" over the past few seasons. If JJ Watt wants to come play for Pittsburgh or Green Bay and doesn't really want a whopping deal to do so, I'm sure their front offices will make it work.

At some point though, the chickens do have to come home to roost and the proverbial "can, can only be kicked down the road for so long before it's time to pay the piper. It will be interesting to see how teams like the Saints, Steelers and even the Packers deal with it between now and the start of the league year in mid-March.

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JJ Watt released Feb 14, 2021 19:08:04 GMT -6 suncoastvike and comet52 like this

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Post by Deleted on Feb 14, 2021 19:08:04 GMT -6

Feb 14, 2021 12:52:09 GMT -6 HarryHits22 said:

Just so I can get a clear take here, because I believe the Vikings cap situation IS quite detrimental to the team this year and next year, and I thought that was a widely held belief around here. Is that the case, or do you believe that the salary cap is easily manipulated for teams to do as they please, leaving the Packers as strong contenders in free agency this year?

You are right with both teams cap situations as they stand now.

The big difference however is GB has contracts that can easily be reworked whereas the Vikings don't.

The Bakhtiari decision was an easy one because he is in their long term plans.They also have Davantae Adams in the final year of his deal,so can work out a new contract to lower his 2021 cap hit of $16M to a more manageable number,and they have Rogers contract than can be restructured/extended to free up a lot of cap space.

The Vikings on the other hand extended Cousins last season and he doesn't seem open to doing anything with a contract that he hasn't even played a single down on.

They have decisions to make on players like Barr/Rudolph,do they want to keep them or cut them?

I think the main point is that one team has a roster that can win the division and make a deep playoff run and doesn't have a lot of holes to fill,therefore negotiating with players/agents is easier.

The other team has a roster full of holes,question marks on players health,but still thinks it can win the division and make a playoff run.

Last Edit: Feb 14, 2021 19:09:47 GMT -6 by Deleted

Uncle
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JJ Watt released Feb 16, 2021 13:11:06 GMT -6

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Post by Uncle on Feb 16, 2021 13:11:06 GMT -6

From Mary Kay Cabot of Cleveland.com (link):

J.J. Watt is seriously considering the Browns as one of his options because they have what he wants, sources say

Released by the Texans on Friday, Watt is seriously considering the Browns as one of his options because they have a lot of what he wants, sources tell cleveland.com.

The two biggest things? Money and a potential Super Bowl. What’s more, they have a strong supporting cast and a positive environment. Check, check, check, and check.

Coming off of a frustrating 4-12 season, Watt wants to play for a Super Bowl contender, and the Browns check off that all-important box. They made it into the final eight last season, losing to the defending Super Bowl champion Chiefs, 22-17, in the AFC Divisional round.

Watt, 32, also wants to get paid his market value, and the Browns have the cap space to pay him. They’re 10th in the NFL with about $21.7 million in space. Watt was due to make $17.5 million in 2021, and will probably be looking for something in that ballpark.

The Browns were prepared to pay about that much last offseason to Jadeveon Clowney, making him a higher one-year offer than any other team, and a very competitive multiyear offer.

Watt, a five-time first-team All-Pro, certainly won’t come cheap, but he’d be worth it if he can get the Browns over the top and into that elusive Super Bowl.

Many of the teams interested in Watt are cap-strapped and won’t be able to pull it off. The Steelers, who already have Watt’s two brothers T.J. and Derek Watt on their roster, are currently about $30 million over the cap. Ben Roethlisberger has said he’ll restructure his contract to bring down his $41.5 million cap hit for 2021, but they’d likely have to make other moves to make it happen.

Watt has gushed over Bucs QB Tom Brady, who just won his seventh Super Bowl, and would undoubtedly love to join him in Tampa, where the Bucs are 11th in cap space with about $14.8 million left, according to overthecap.com.

“Tom’s unbelievable. It’s incredible what he’s done. I don’t think people truly understand or appreciate or can fathom how insanely difficult it is,’' Watt said on The Tonight Show with Jimmy Fallon. “The guy’s just, he’s the greatest of all time.”

There’s talk he’d also love to go to Green Bay in his home state and play with Aaron Rodgers, but the Packers are also currently over the cap by about $19 million. Others teams he’s been linked to are also in cap trouble, including the Titans (over by $3 million), the Bills (over by $322,851), and the Bears (over by $191,825).

In addition to the Browns’ current $21.7 million available, they can clear more cap room depending on roster moves they make this offseason.

But they wasted no time in dialing up Watt’s reps on Friday, and they can make a competitive offer and compelling presentation.

“He’s a very, very unique player in that his combination of size, strength, athleticism, quickness and power is really unrivaled,” Browns coach Kevin Stefanski said of Watt in November, before the Browns beat the Texans 10-7 in fierce winds at FirstEnergy Stadium on Nov. 15. “He gets those long arms up, and he bats balls in the air. He’s a very, very disruptive player. He lines up all over the formation, so you can’t key in on where he is going to be. I have a huge amount of respect for what he has done in his career.”

Watt, who was constantly double-teamed in 2020 and held to only five sacks, would also have the benefit of bookending with Myles Garrett, who will draw plenty of attention and free Watt up to make plays. In Joe Woods’ defense, he’d likely be back to double-digit sacks in 2021.

“[Garrett’s] obviously having a great year so far,’' Watt said before their meeting in November. “Hopefully he doesn’t have a good game on Sunday. That’s the goal for us. The guy’s a hell of a player. He’s got speed. He’s got quickness and power. He’s got all the tools you need, and he’s obviously playing at an extremely high level.”

Supporting cast and team culture are also two high priorities for Watt, sources say, and the Browns meet both of those criteria. The club will bolster the defense this offseason, and players love playing for Stefanski and the rest of his staff. The vibe in Cleveland is good, and Watt will get a good report from Garrett and others.

His frustration with the losing culture in Houston boiled over after a 37-31 loss to the Bengals in Week 16, and the writing was on the wall that he wanted out.

“We’re professional athletes getting paid a whole lot of money,” Watt told reporters after the game. “If you can’t come in and put work in in the building, go out to the practice field and work hard, do your lifts and do what you’re supposed to do, you should not be here. This is a job. We are getting paid a whole lot of money.

“There are a lot of people that watch us and invest their time and their money into buying our jerseys and buying a whole bunch of s---, and they care about it. They care every single week. We’re in Week 16 and we’re 4-11, and there’s fans that watch this game, that show up to the stadium that put in time and energy and effort and care about this. So if you can’t go out there and you can’t work out, you can’t show up on time, you can’t practice, you can’t want to go out there and win, you shouldn’t be here. Because this is a privilege. It’s the greatest job in the world. You get to go out and play a game. And if you can’t care enough, even in Week 17, even when you’re trash, when you’re 4-11. If you can’t care enough to go out there and give everything you’ve got and try your hardest, that’s bulls—.’'

Watt will find the opposite in Cleveland, where Stefanski changed the culture to one of accountability and winning in one season.

I guess the Vikings don't check off any of Watts' boxes...

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JJ Watt released Feb 16, 2021 18:38:13 GMT -6

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Post by Danchat on Feb 16, 2021 18:38:13 GMT -6

That'd be a good get for the Browns, they could use a leader like him on the defense. On a 4-3 defense his size would make more sense as a 3 tech, but they are paying Sheldon Richardson pretty handsomely to do that. Still, a Garrett-Watt-Richardson D-line would be a good unit. I hope he signs there over the Packers or Steelers.

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JJ Watt released Feb 16, 2021 19:35:14 GMT -6

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Post by Uncle on Feb 16, 2021 19:35:14 GMT -6

If the Browns do end up adding JJ Watt, that could decrease the # of potential trade partners in the 1st Round for the Vikes. Who knows exactly how the board will go come draft night before the Vikings first pick, but in terms of potential teams that would be willing to part w/ Day 2 draft capital to move up, I was thinking the Browns were a good bet because they had "extra" Day 2 / early Day 3 capital (they have two picks in the 3rd and 4th Rds) and they have a need to add a DE opposite Myles Garrett, so they may have been willing to move up to get Rousseau. Now, it doesn't mean they won't and they may want a DL of Garrett-JJ Watt-Richardson-Rousseau, or they may want one of three top CB's, but if they land Watt, I'm not sure the need to get one of the top DL prospects will be there...

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JJ Watt released Mar 2, 2021 8:12:21 GMT -6 via mobile Minniman likes this

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Post by comet52 on Mar 2, 2021 8:12:21 GMT -6

Signed with the Cardinals. Not a single guess about where he'd end up was accurate. Playing with his brother, playing back home, playing for a title... all hooey
In the end he went where he could get the ca$h.

Last Edit: Mar 2, 2021 8:13:36 GMT -6 by comet52

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Danchat Content Creator Posts: 19,026 Likes: 16,610 Member is Online	JJ Watt released Mar 2, 2021 12:18:50 GMT -6 Funkytown, comet52, and 2 more like this Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by Danchat on Mar 2, 2021 12:18:50 GMT -6

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JJ Watt released Mar 2, 2021 16:44:44 GMT -6

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Post by Minniman on Mar 2, 2021 16:44:44 GMT -6

Mar 2, 2021 8:12:21 GMT -6 comet52 said:

Signed with the Cardinals. Not a single guess about where he'd end up was accurate. Playing with his brother, playing back home, playing for a title... all hooey

In the end he went where he could get the ca$h.

J.J. Watt went to a team he though was up and coming and had the cap space to show him the money.

Watt was once a great player, but is he still?

Logic is the beginning of wisdom - not the end.