Another surprise: Wonnum

Minniman
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Another surprise: Wonnum Nov 19, 2020 10:26:14 GMT -6

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Post by Minniman on Nov 19, 2020 10:26:14 GMT -6

Nov 19, 2020 8:51:52 GMT -6 Danchat said:

Nov 19, 2020 7:39:07 GMT -6 diehardtwinsfan said:

he's a 4th round pick... any 4th rounder is going to be a project, so I guess I'm questioning what the reach is...

Wonnum was seen as a 6th round-ish propsect, which is why he was called a reach by some.

The draft is all about getting the best player available while avoiding opportunity costs.

Physically, Wonnum has good height, arm length, and hand size. He has good speed, but his acceleration and upper body strength were both questionable coming out. I did not research the draft this year other than at WR and QB, so I can't say much more than that other than I did read draft reports for him going anywhere in rounds 4 through 6. Does that make him a reach? Maybe, but it isn't like the Vikings drafted him in the second round.

I respect your opinions when it comes to the draft. Did you believe Wonnum was a reach or that the Vikings had a good chance to pick him up with a later pick and missed out on a better prospect at that position? Seriously, I am asking because I was going into the draft much more blind than usual.

Last Edit: Nov 19, 2020 11:01:59 GMT -6 by Minniman

Logic is the beginning of wisdom - not the end.

Danchat
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Another surprise: Wonnum Nov 19, 2020 11:30:46 GMT -6

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Post by Danchat on Nov 19, 2020 11:30:46 GMT -6

Nov 19, 2020 10:26:14 GMT -6 Minniman said:

I respect your opinions when it comes to the draft. Did you believe Wonnum was a reach or that the Vikings had a good chance to pick him up with a later pick and missed out on a better prospect at that position? Seriously, I am asking because I was going into the draft much more blind than usual.

Here's an image from a post I made a bit after the grade, consolidating my opinions on the picks. Charlie Campbell and Dane Brugler had him potentially as a 4th, so it wasn't a massive reach, but CBS Sports and PFF were not high on him at all. I'm assuming the injuries and lack of production at South Carolina had to do with that. According to pSparq he was an average athlete, but was a top 20% percentile athlete by RAS' standards.

I didn't hate the pick since I've been fine with the tradition 4th rounder spent on a D-lineman for Andre Patterson to mold, but I was concerned we'd miss out on Lynch. I would have liked it better if he was our third 4th round selection instead of first, but clearly he looks better than expected. Hopefully they'll find another toolsy 4th rounder D-lineman in next year's draft too.

Minniman
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Another surprise: Wonnum Nov 19, 2020 12:01:41 GMT -6

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Post by Minniman on Nov 19, 2020 12:01:41 GMT -6

Nov 19, 2020 11:30:46 GMT -6 Danchat said:

Nov 19, 2020 10:26:14 GMT -6 Minniman said:

I respect your opinions when it comes to the draft. Did you believe Wonnum was a reach or that the Vikings had a good chance to pick him up with a later pick and missed out on a better prospect at that position? Seriously, I am asking because I was going into the draft much more blind than usual.

Here's an image from a post I made a bit after the grade, consolidating my opinions on the picks. Charlie Campbell and Dane Brugler had him potentially as a 4th, so it wasn't a massive reach, but CBS Sports and PFF were not high on him at all. I'm assuming the injuries and lack of production at South Carolina had to do with that. According to pSparq he was an average athlete, but was a top 20% percentile athlete by RAS' standards.

I didn't hate the pick since I've been fine with the tradition 4th rounder spent on a D-lineman for Andre Patterson to mold, but I was concerned we'd miss out on Lynch. I would have liked it better if he was our third 4th round selection instead of first, but clearly he looks better than expected. Hopefully they'll find another toolsy 4th rounder D-lineman in next year's draft too.

James Lynch had better production, but his arm length, wingspan, and hand size may make his transition to the NFL more difficult. His high motor and nose for the football will help.

Logic is the beginning of wisdom - not the end.

diehardtwinsfan
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Another surprise: Wonnum Nov 19, 2020 12:20:13 GMT -6 Josey Wales likes this

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Post by diehardtwinsfan on Nov 19, 2020 12:20:13 GMT -6

Nov 19, 2020 8:51:52 GMT -6 Danchat said:

Nov 19, 2020 7:39:07 GMT -6 diehardtwinsfan said:

he's a 4th round pick... any 4th rounder is going to be a project, so I guess I'm questioning what the reach is...

Wonnum was seen as a 6th round-ish propsect, which is why he was called a reach by some.

I am not really arguing with as I suspect you agree, but I guess this is where common sense really needs to start coming into play with said "some". The further down the boards you go, the less the gap between players. I cannot speak for every team, but to say that 31 other teams didn't have a 5th round grade on him or 15 other teams didn't have a 4th round grade on him might be pushing things a bit in my opinion (especially given how well he's performed so far), and part of Rick accumulating all of those later round picks is so that he can go out and get those types of players as he sees fit... Bottom line, would Wonnum have been around for our next pick? Who knows. I don't... but that 4-6 range doesn't really qualify as a reach in my opinion... perhaps if he was taken in the 2nd or 3rd, sure.

I personally was looking for DT help there with that pick and if I remember right, we passed on a couple DTs that weren't there when we took Lynch 15 or so picks later. Was it the right answer? only time will tell. Rick has to take all of that into account. It would be interesting to see how those DTs have stacked up against Wonnum.

giveu1guess
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Another surprise: Wonnum Nov 19, 2020 12:48:29 GMT -6 via Tapatalk

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Post by giveu1guess on Nov 19, 2020 12:48:29 GMT -6

Nov 19, 2020 9:45:39 GMT -6 Josey Wales said:

Nov 19, 2020 8:37:23 GMT -6 giveu1guess said:

Ricky Bobby, ladies and gents!!!!

We have an ideal scheme/philosophy fit for our defense in Wonnum who our co-DC loves...... yet our GM goes and trades a 2nd for a guy who is not a fit..... brilliant!!!!!

Wait, so you're NOT on board with a Spielman move??

Well....this is an arresting development.

In all seriousness, that was one of the worst trades of Rick's tenure with the Vikings, not having a 2nd will severely impact our ability to trade up for a QB, if that's the route they choose in the 2021 draft.

I like to keep y'all guessing.....

For sure, didn't think of it in that context, but it does make sense.

giveu1guess
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Another surprise: Wonnum Nov 19, 2020 12:50:20 GMT -6 via Tapatalk

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Post by giveu1guess on Nov 19, 2020 12:50:20 GMT -6

Nov 19, 2020 10:24:33 GMT -6 whoskmoon said:

Nov 19, 2020 8:51:52 GMT -6 Danchat said:

Wonnum was seen as a 6th round-ish propsect, which is why he was called a reach by some.

Do you think Zimmer wasn't on board with the move, because I doubt that highly. I think their assumption was that Ngakoue would complement Hunter well and they did not expect him to miss the whole season. Obviously not a good move, but pinning the blame on Rick when Zimmer is the mastermind of the defense seems silly.

I think the trade happened because they realized Hunter wasn't going to be available and panicked.

Agreed. It was a panic move by Ricky Bobby, just like the Sammy Two Sleeves trade was.

Our star DE is out indefinitely.... and so he sees an above average DE available via trade.... automatically in his brain: "perfect... let's do this"....... without considering the fine details such as system/philosophy fit.....

That's how Ricky Bobby rolls.......

Josey Wales
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Another surprise: Wonnum Nov 19, 2020 14:02:41 GMT -6 via mobile vikingpwr and giveu1guess like this

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Post by Josey Wales on Nov 19, 2020 14:02:41 GMT -6

Nov 19, 2020 12:48:29 GMT -6 giveu1guess said:

Nov 19, 2020 9:45:39 GMT -6 Josey Wales said:

Wait, so you're NOT on board with a Spielman move??

Well....this is an arresting development.

In all seriousness, that was one of the worst trades of Rick's tenure with the Vikings, not having a 2nd will severely impact our ability to trade up for a QB, if that's the route they choose in the 2021 draft.

I like to keep y'all guessing.....

For sure, didn't think of it in that context, but it does make sense.

On your sanity?

Mission accomplished..

😁

Last Edit: Nov 19, 2020 15:30:20 GMT -6 by Josey Wales

vikingpwr
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Another surprise: Wonnum Nov 19, 2020 17:23:56 GMT -6 NoresemanSam likes this

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Post by vikingpwr on Nov 19, 2020 17:23:56 GMT -6

Nov 18, 2020 18:15:46 GMT -6 wivikesfan said:

This guy came outta nowhere. He was largely considered a reach when they drafted him and despite less playing time, I believe he has created as many pressures as Chase Young. Patterson for Prez.

People tend to forget Ricky traded down in the 1st and got a 4th rounder in the deal. He traded our 25th for San Francisco's 31st..Gladney, 117th..Wonnum and 176th..KJ Osborn

Last Edit: Nov 19, 2020 17:30:01 GMT -6 by vikingpwr

giveu1guess
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Another surprise: Wonnum Nov 19, 2020 18:14:03 GMT -6 via Tapatalk Josey Wales likes this

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Post by giveu1guess on Nov 19, 2020 18:14:03 GMT -6

Nov 19, 2020 14:02:41 GMT -6 Josey Wales said:

Nov 19, 2020 12:48:29 GMT -6 giveu1guess said:

I like to keep y'all guessing.....

For sure, didn't think of it in that context, but it does make sense.

On your sanity?

Mission accomplished..

😁

🤣🤣🤣 the 3 picks I really liked by Ricky Bobby from last 2 drafts: Wonnum, Dantzler, and Mattison. In no specific order. They stood out to me, at the time, as great value picks.... I could care less what draftzzz expertzzzz say.... at the time those picks were made, we had needs in those positions and they were great fits for us........

Josey Wales
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Another surprise: Wonnum Nov 19, 2020 19:15:09 GMT -6 via mobile giveu1guess likes this

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Post by Josey Wales on Nov 19, 2020 19:15:09 GMT -6

Nov 19, 2020 18:14:03 GMT -6 giveu1guess said:

Nov 19, 2020 14:02:41 GMT -6 Josey Wales said:

On your sanity?

Mission accomplished..

😁

🤣🤣🤣 the 3 picks I really liked by Ricky Bobby from last 2 drafts: Wonnum, Dantzler, and Mattison. In no specific order. They stood out to me, at the time, as great value picks.... I could care less what draftzzz expertzzzz say.... at the time those picks were made, we had needs in those positions and they were great fits for us........

Didn't know that much about Wonnum but I definitely wanted Dantzler, the dude locked down Jamar Chase and a bunch of other big-name receivers, I believe he has the potential to be something special with time.

mikenessfan
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Another surprise: Wonnum Nov 19, 2020 19:51:37 GMT -6 via mobile giveu1guess likes this

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Post by mikenessfan on Nov 19, 2020 19:51:37 GMT -6

Nov 19, 2020 18:14:03 GMT -6 giveu1guess said:

Nov 19, 2020 14:02:41 GMT -6 Josey Wales said:

On your sanity?

Mission accomplished..

😁

🤣🤣🤣 the 3 picks I really liked by Ricky Bobby from last 2 drafts: Wonnum, Dantzler, and Mattison. In no specific order. They stood out to me, at the time, as great value picks.... I could care less what draftzzz expertzzzz say.... at the time those picks were made, we had needs in those positions and they were great fits for us........

I really liked the irv smith pick from last year. I could tell this kid has top 10 te potential right away and I think he could be better. Problem is I don’t think we are still using him enough. He is definitely a weapon.

mikenessfan
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Another surprise: Wonnum Nov 19, 2020 19:56:44 GMT -6 via mobile

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Post by mikenessfan on Nov 19, 2020 19:56:44 GMT -6

Nov 19, 2020 18:14:03 GMT -6 giveu1guess said:

Nov 19, 2020 14:02:41 GMT -6 Josey Wales said:

On your sanity?

Mission accomplished..

😁

🤣🤣🤣 the 3 picks I really liked by Ricky Bobby from last 2 drafts: Wonnum, Dantzler, and Mattison. In no specific order. They stood out to me, at the time, as great value picks.... I could care less what draftzzz expertzzzz say.... at the time those picks were made, we had needs in those positions and they were great fits for us........

Spielman definitely can hit in some picks. Unfortunately the most important one in qb he has always struggled.

vikingpwr Living Legend Posts: 21,402 Likes: 4,611	Another surprise: Wonnum Nov 19, 2020 20:33:29 GMT -6 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by vikingpwr on Nov 19, 2020 20:33:29 GMT -6 Nov 19, 2020 19:51:37 GMT -6 mikenessfan said: Problem is I don’t think we are still using him enough. I don't see that problem.

vikingpwr
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Another surprise: Wonnum Nov 19, 2020 20:37:41 GMT -6

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Post by vikingpwr on Nov 19, 2020 20:37:41 GMT -6

Nov 19, 2020 12:50:20 GMT -6 giveu1guess said:

Agreed. It was a panic move by Ricky Bobby, just like the Sammy Two Sleeves trade was.

Panic? I don't think so. I see it as a move that didn't quite work out. Staying with Hill might've worked.... (roflmao)

giveu1guess
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Another surprise: Wonnum Nov 19, 2020 20:42:01 GMT -6 via Tapatalk

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Post by giveu1guess on Nov 19, 2020 20:42:01 GMT -6

Nov 19, 2020 19:56:44 GMT -6 mikenessfan said:

Nov 19, 2020 18:14:03 GMT -6 giveu1guess said:

🤣🤣🤣 the 3 picks I really liked by Ricky Bobby from last 2 drafts: Wonnum, Dantzler, and Mattison. In no specific order. They stood out to me, at the time, as great value picks.... I could care less what draftzzz expertzzzz say.... at the time those picks were made, we had needs in those positions and they were great fits for us........

Spielman definitely can hit in some picks. Unfortunately the most important one in qb he has always struggled.

I feel like his biggest shortcoming in general is that, at times, he completely disregards scheme and philosophy fit. He seems to think you can add the big talents (for example CP84 or Ngakoue or Mike Wallace) and it will just magically work itself out. Wtf?

That's not what good GMs do. Look at Belichik. He is ALL about fit. Who fits his team and what he wants to do....